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Topic: Promoters could learn a lot from minor league baseball
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Page 2 of 2 of 27 replies
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June 14, 2009 at
03:53:50 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: race88 on June 14 2009 at 03:36:33 PM
So they tried the swap meet deal ,did they consider it successful? as far as me giving a couple of vouchers out ..it was a Vista paints promotion,I'm sure Vista paid the track...I picked a family,told them it was like being a guest of the Ripper...next time that family was considering what to do ..maybe then came back to the races ..so what do you do Jeff..you film the races edit and post clips on this forum and others..is that better promotion ..Hell Yes ..people see your clips and say damn I gotta get to the track next time.....Bottom line Jeff,wouldn't matter what I said...you know I dislike USAC as an organization and I'll smile the day the last USAC truck rolls over the stateline heading east [where they belong] but that doesn't mean I dislike the people in the pits wearing USAC uniforms,a lot are SCRA that I respected and admire...Perris needs to be successful,when USAC's gone the Ca. racers and Perris will need to work together [like when Perris opened] to make Sprint ar races the place to be Sat. night
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So you believe its OK to promote within the race community or not...I'm confused.
Perris Auto Speedway does a lot of great promotion...within the race community...they need new fans
I do what I do to promote 410 sprint car racing in southern California, not USAC or any particular track. You, as I've said before, do everything in your power to convince people to stay home.
Jeff Kristensen
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June 14, 2009 at
05:08:58 PM
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Posted By: Lumpy Rutherford on June 13 2009 at 10:55:29 PM
I could write a book on this subject but a HUGE majority of short tracks these days do next to no advertising, there's no pizzazz, no buzz, and accordingly, next to nobody in the grandstands.
Agree about the back gate tracks with 8 classes- about 7 of which I could care less about and 92 total entries. Total boredom.
For the people that say cutting the ticket price in half doesn't affect attendance I suggest going to Eagle on a $5 ticket night-the place is PACKED...... Roger Haden Jr is one of the VERY FEW good promoters left in the country. Jon McCorkell also does a good job at Jackson.
CSJones/race88- I watched the youtube video of the LM rollover a couple of weeks ago at Farley, I am guessing "Simmons promotions" doesn't do much in the way of filling the grandstands as on the video it looked like there must have been about 50 people in the stands.
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You're right about the $5 Fan Appreciation Nights, but if you do it more than about twice a year it has the opposite effect. It cheapens the event because it is no longer something special. But, we're not hurting for crowds. My guess would be somewhere between 1500 and 2000 a night every week.
Of course, it helps that Roger IS a great promoter. Every week is a themed night with some special deal going on. Next week is the Fathers Day Tribute where the first 300 fathers get a special gift and there will be fans drag racing during intermission. This week was Fan with a can night where the donation of 2 cans of food to the local Food Banks got you a $2 discount. The biggest crowds of the year are usually there on "Kids Bike Night". Last year 3 semi-trailers of bikes were given away to random kids in the crowd, and this year will probably easily break that figure. The looks on those little faces goes a long way to making parents want to return. Roger buys a bike for every 2 that the fans, racers and teams purchase.
And those who say that adding "junk" classes drives fans away are WRONG!!!!!!!!! If Eagle had to depend solely on sprint cars and fans it would have been out of business years ago. We run 4 classes every week, and each of those classes brings different fans with them.
Last night we had 24 360 sprint cars, 34 hobby stocks, 39 modifieds and 33 sport compacts. Now, how many people did each of those cars generate? If it was just the sprints we'd be lucky to get 500 people, a loss of 1000-1500 hineys in the seats and a commensurate loss of revenue at the concession stands.
This year Roger (Roger Jr. is his son by the way) negotiated a deal with another local track to move their racing to Friday night and entered into a joint venture with them. Cars that run 75% of both tracks races are eligible for an extra point fund. Also, the top 3 finishers in the A features get free admission to the pits for the other track's next race if they are actually racing there. AND the fans can use their tickets for a "BOGO" deal at the other track also. The other track went from maybe 200-300 fans every week to 800-1000 and Eagle has seen an increase also; win/win for both tracks in fans and car counts.
It also helps that Roger will usually be found at the pit gate welcoming the teams as they come in each week and is readily available and approachable if a team, driver or even a fan has a problem or concern.
Considering that there are an awful lot (some would say too many) options for people's disposable income nowadays, tracks need to work their butts off to keep running. Advertising does help but giving the fans a reason to return week after week does a heckuva lot more. And the word of mouth is the BEST advertising that there is.
It CAN be done, but it takes a LOT of work and a promoter with great ideas and on who is willing to put them into action does a lot more.
I am lucky enough to work at one of the best tracks
anywhere.
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June 15, 2009 at
12:33:09 AM
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Not trying to start an argument but I thought the promoter/former modified/late model driver was Roger Haden Jr. His dad Roger Haden Sr raced at Sunset in the 70's and early '80's and his grandfather August Haden was one of the founders of Sunset Speedway in the '50's? Current racer Roger "Chevy" Haden is Roger Haden III or so I was told?
race88- it seems to me if a racetrack has seating for 2000 people and there are actually 100 in the stands it should be treated as a supply/demand issue. What would be lost by most tracks by cutting ticket prices from $10 to $4 or $5 for every regular race? Even if you only get the same 100 people you are only out $500 or $600 and if attendance increases you will make that up fairly quickly at the concession stand?? And start an ad campaign hyping the race track as your town's "least expensive live entertainment option" or something along those lines.
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June 15, 2009 at
10:36:27 AM
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Heck Lumpy, you could very well be right. Sorry if I muddled the issue with that error. All I've ever known the 2 as was Roger and Chevy, but knew Chevy's real name was Roger also.
I am lucky enough to work at one of the best tracks
anywhere.
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June 15, 2009 at
04:38:59 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Lumpy Rutherford on June 15 2009 at 12:33:09 AM
Not trying to start an argument but I thought the promoter/former modified/late model driver was Roger Haden Jr. His dad Roger Haden Sr raced at Sunset in the 70's and early '80's and his grandfather August Haden was one of the founders of Sunset Speedway in the '50's? Current racer Roger "Chevy" Haden is Roger Haden III or so I was told?
race88- it seems to me if a racetrack has seating for 2000 people and there are actually 100 in the stands it should be treated as a supply/demand issue. What would be lost by most tracks by cutting ticket prices from $10 to $4 or $5 for every regular race? Even if you only get the same 100 people you are only out $500 or $600 and if attendance increases you will make that up fairly quickly at the concession stand?? And start an ad campaign hyping the race track as your town's "least expensive live entertainment option" or something along those lines.
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Lumpy,thanks for the input.The promoter charged $10,gave out $3 off vouchers and still couldn't increase the attendence.Your correct about an ad campaign,the guy gives us a great track every time,shame he can't get a crowd......BTW fairground get concessions
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June 15, 2009 at
05:19:51 PM
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We need Jackie Moon!!! lol.
BS aside - there is a fantastic New Age promoter down in Texas - his name is Darin Short. and the track he most works with - Cowtown Speedway - has a fantastic promoter in Bo Rawdon. Both seem to work together very well - or so I assume - I love making the 3.5 hour drive down there. The racin' is good and plenty of it. The concessions are great and it is an extremely family/fan friendly place. They have all sorts of promotions and do cool things. Yell-offs - throwin candy to the littlin's, etc. - they are on the right track - and always thinkin of new inventive ideas.
btw - Darin Short is better known as DmanTX on here lol. You'll surely see him on here promoting the ASCS Lone Star Region race comin' up at Cowtown next weekend - they are doing special promotions for that too. Both Short and Rawdon are a seemingly rare breed of promoters. That combination has in my mind catipulted Cowtown Speedway to one of the premier tracks in that area. I don't want to sound the authority on that - as RPM, Grand Prarie, Devils Bowl, Boyd, Abilene and others - all may be really good.
So I guess suffice to say Cowtown is by far my favorite track in Texas. And probably my favorite saturday night track anywhere. Always comin' up with purse increases for the drivers - I mean the little things they do there are endless - they aren't even little things - it's just that they do a lot it is hard to keep up lol. And there is a forum/message board for Cowtown on its track website - many times I see Bo Rawdon get on to address criticism, questions, or whatnot. And damn near always in very respectful and reasonable manner. not many promoters do that - especially in a classy manner.
First Class promoters runnin a stand up operation.
How much would could a wouldchuck chuck if a
wouldchuck could chuck would
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June 15, 2009 at
06:46:42 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Eagle Pit Shack Guy on June 14 2009 at 05:08:58 PM
You're right about the $5 Fan Appreciation Nights, but if you do it more than about twice a year it has the opposite effect. It cheapens the event because it is no longer something special. But, we're not hurting for crowds. My guess would be somewhere between 1500 and 2000 a night every week.
Of course, it helps that Roger IS a great promoter. Every week is a themed night with some special deal going on. Next week is the Fathers Day Tribute where the first 300 fathers get a special gift and there will be fans drag racing during intermission. This week was Fan with a can night where the donation of 2 cans of food to the local Food Banks got you a $2 discount. The biggest crowds of the year are usually there on "Kids Bike Night". Last year 3 semi-trailers of bikes were given away to random kids in the crowd, and this year will probably easily break that figure. The looks on those little faces goes a long way to making parents want to return. Roger buys a bike for every 2 that the fans, racers and teams purchase.
And those who say that adding "junk" classes drives fans away are WRONG!!!!!!!!! If Eagle had to depend solely on sprint cars and fans it would have been out of business years ago. We run 4 classes every week, and each of those classes brings different fans with them.
Last night we had 24 360 sprint cars, 34 hobby stocks, 39 modifieds and 33 sport compacts. Now, how many people did each of those cars generate? If it was just the sprints we'd be lucky to get 500 people, a loss of 1000-1500 hineys in the seats and a commensurate loss of revenue at the concession stands.
This year Roger (Roger Jr. is his son by the way) negotiated a deal with another local track to move their racing to Friday night and entered into a joint venture with them. Cars that run 75% of both tracks races are eligible for an extra point fund. Also, the top 3 finishers in the A features get free admission to the pits for the other track's next race if they are actually racing there. AND the fans can use their tickets for a "BOGO" deal at the other track also. The other track went from maybe 200-300 fans every week to 800-1000 and Eagle has seen an increase also; win/win for both tracks in fans and car counts.
It also helps that Roger will usually be found at the pit gate welcoming the teams as they come in each week and is readily available and approachable if a team, driver or even a fan has a problem or concern.
Considering that there are an awful lot (some would say too many) options for people's disposable income nowadays, tracks need to work their butts off to keep running. Advertising does help but giving the fans a reason to return week after week does a heckuva lot more. And the word of mouth is the BEST advertising that there is.
It CAN be done, but it takes a LOT of work and a promoter with great ideas and on who is willing to put them into action does a lot more.
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Eagle Pit Shack Guy,
If you eliminated some of the junk, you might actually be able to attract some sprint car fans. The people that support the entry level classes are friends and family. If Eagle is so damn proud of the entry level classes, encourage them to drop the sprints! Maybe they could add school buses, or pickups, or a b-mod, c-mod, d-mod, e-mod, f-mod class. Maybe you could introduce a cheaper version of the "hornet"? Good luck!
Lets use Knoxville as an example. The people that frequent Knoxville not only love sprint cars, but more importantly, they love racing. They don't need a candy toss or a free Walmart bike to get them excited about buying a ticket. They want to go; because they're afraid if they don't, that they might miss out on something special! Clown suits or get a free ticket if you bring your cousins best friend's sister's husband are just gimmicks. They work about as well as the hornet class, when it comes to attracting ticket buying race fans.
Promoters need to figure out how to get fans fired up about what's going on the track. They need to evaluate the value of their show and make adjustments accordingly. If your program sucks, it won't matter how many tickets you give away; it won't matter how clean your restrooms are; it won't matter how pretty the trophy girl is; you still won't be able to attract large groups of people.
More importantly, we need to stop expecting less and less and less and less and less and less! It's that attitude, along with a jar of vaseline that got us into this mess in the first place.
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June 16, 2009 at
08:52:11 PM
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This message was edited on
June 16, 2009 at
08:55:58 PM by Eagle Pit Shack Guy
Well Pitnotes, I don't quite know how to respond to that diatribe except to say in short simple words that you might understand.
THERE ARE NOT THAT MANY SPRINT FANS IN THE LINCOLN/OMAHA METRO AREA.
Got it now?
And if Knoxville is so "special" why does Eagle draw more fans weekly than they do????
Knoxville is a great facility, no doubt about it...absolutely top-notch; but without the Nationals there would be NO racing weekly there.
Your personal idea of junk obviously isn't universal. Every class of cars has their fans, and to make it nowadays at a dirt track you have to cater to ALL of the fans and give them what they want.
Obviously you don't like to watch other classes, so feel free to go to Knoxville along with the other thousand folks. That's your prerogative.
I am lucky enough to work at one of the best tracks
anywhere.
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