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Topic: Thoughts on high limit
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November 13, 2023 at
01:05:48 PM
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I am hearing that the high limit is doing everything the exact same as the outlaws. The only thing different is the choose cone. Same structure, pay outs, points fund, starting pay, etc. That is just silly to me. I was at first, very excited about high limit purchasing the All Stars. Then I hear no shows at Knoxville, and using the outlaw format.
That just makes 0 sense. That is telling me the high limit series, thinks the WRG group and outlaw format is the best. Come on high limit, you can do much better. The true All Star format was perfect. It made for much better racing! I watched 90% of the outlaws races, and 80% of the all star races in the last 3 years. Overall, the best racing was the all stars, hand down.
I think competition is good, I think it could improve both series. I think it is good for the fans. There once was a day, where the outlaw drivers were the best. Now, I could see drivers like Brad Sweet, Tyler C, Rico A, Anthony M, Brent M, cherry picking the outlaws, kinda funny actually. When I was a kid, 80's and early 90's I can never recall a outlaw driver not finishing on the podium. A few weeks back 1 night at Charlotte, top 5 didn't even have an outlaw driver in it. Maybe 1 snuck in the last lap, maybe not. I also remember a time an outlaw ticket was 25.00. The winner got paid 10k. Now an outlaw ticket is what 47 plus? Outlaws paid 10k to win on average in 23. I have seen a post from McKenna Haase wishing tracks would put that huge winners share, more towards the whole field. I see her point there, but that is what makes the 2 series beneficial for the low buck racer, who now has a chance of making the shows, when half of the drivers are competing in either series.
if high limit is going to do everything the same as the outlaws, I have lost interest already. If they are going to charge the same as WRG, to host events, no thanks. If this becomes a war with Flo, and DIRTVision, I will boycott both. The amazing times we live in, there are results posted immediately on Facebook and other sources, I am happy with that. I hope in 25 high limit and knoxville can meet in the middle. I am hoping folks from high limit can tell me I got everything all wrong, and that they will be different, and try to be better.
Jeff M
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November 13, 2023 at
02:43:21 PM
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This message was edited on
November 13, 2023 at
02:46:37 PM by tenter
These top heavy $100,000+ to win races are killing the local and regional teams. Imagine what it would be like to pay $25,000 to win , and spread the rest of the $75,000 back throughout the A & B main fields. You could add $2000 onto every other starter in the A-main ($46,000) and then have $28,000 left to pay from 5th on back in the B-main.
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November 13, 2023 at
02:54:35 PM
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This message was edited on
November 13, 2023 at
03:00:36 PM by BStrawser26
Reply to:
Posted By: tenter on November 13 2023 at 02:43:21 PM
These top heavy $100,000+ to win races are killing the local and regional teams. Imagine what it would be like to pay $25,000 to win , and spread the rest of the $75,000 back throughout the A & B main fields. You could add $2000 onto every other starter in the A-main ($46,000) and then have $28,000 left to pay from 5th on back in the B-main.
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True socialism if I ever saw it.
The bmain cars get tow and not 28 grand worth either. That is way too high. You are now penalizing the cars that run good.
Let's go Sprint Car Racing!
Knoxville - Best Track In the USA!
Eldora - 2nd Best Track in the USA!
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November 13, 2023 at
02:57:54 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Cardshark24 on November 13 2023 at 01:05:48 PM
I am hearing that the high limit is doing everything the exact same as the outlaws. The only thing different is the choose cone. Same structure, pay outs, points fund, starting pay, etc. That is just silly to me. I was at first, very excited about high limit purchasing the All Stars. Then I hear no shows at Knoxville, and using the outlaw format.
That just makes 0 sense. That is telling me the high limit series, thinks the WRG group and outlaw format is the best. Come on high limit, you can do much better. The true All Star format was perfect. It made for much better racing! I watched 90% of the outlaws races, and 80% of the all star races in the last 3 years. Overall, the best racing was the all stars, hand down.
I think competition is good, I think it could improve both series. I think it is good for the fans. There once was a day, where the outlaw drivers were the best. Now, I could see drivers like Brad Sweet, Tyler C, Rico A, Anthony M, Brent M, cherry picking the outlaws, kinda funny actually. When I was a kid, 80's and early 90's I can never recall a outlaw driver not finishing on the podium. A few weeks back 1 night at Charlotte, top 5 didn't even have an outlaw driver in it. Maybe 1 snuck in the last lap, maybe not. I also remember a time an outlaw ticket was 25.00. The winner got paid 10k. Now an outlaw ticket is what 47 plus? Outlaws paid 10k to win on average in 23. I have seen a post from McKenna Haase wishing tracks would put that huge winners share, more towards the whole field. I see her point there, but that is what makes the 2 series beneficial for the low buck racer, who now has a chance of making the shows, when half of the drivers are competing in either series.
if high limit is going to do everything the same as the outlaws, I have lost interest already. If they are going to charge the same as WRG, to host events, no thanks. If this becomes a war with Flo, and DIRTVision, I will boycott both. The amazing times we live in, there are results posted immediately on Facebook and other sources, I am happy with that. I hope in 25 high limit and knoxville can meet in the middle. I am hoping folks from high limit can tell me I got everything all wrong, and that they will be different, and try to be better.
Jeff M
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Your first paragraph "exactly the same as the outlaws" is incorrect. Maybe this year may look okay, but let's talk again in 2025. If there are more than 3 High Limit teams that make every show, I'll be shocked. Gonna need a contract with their drivers. Eventually exclusive rights to those drivers. That should give everyone the series they were looking for to dethrone the Outlaws------which will be exactly the same as the Outlaws. Not saying that's what Kyle and Brad want, but if all of the Outlaw haters want a replacement, it's gonna have to look exactly the same in the long run.
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November 13, 2023 at
04:53:09 PM
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Everyone seems to love capitalism except in their sports.
In the major four sports its, "We need a salary cap! All the big teams can just buy a championship. Not fair!"
In sprint car racing its, "Spread the purse around to the local and regional teams. How do they expect the low buck guys to compete with these budgets?"
In everyday life? "I think we should get a raise at our job. We're just getting by on our wages."
"You make how much? You should be happy you still have a job."
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November 13, 2023 at
05:06:32 PM
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This message was edited on
November 13, 2023 at
05:07:09 PM by Johnny Utah
Let me be clear, for those that will misconstrue or potentially twist the words, it was just an observation. If the purse would indeed be spread back through the field as Tenter requested, I wouldn't care. I'd say, "Good for those teams."
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November 13, 2023 at
05:16:30 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Johnny Utah on November 13 2023 at 04:53:09 PM
Everyone seems to love capitalism except in their sports.
In the major four sports its, "We need a salary cap! All the big teams can just buy a championship. Not fair!"
In sprint car racing its, "Spread the purse around to the local and regional teams. How do they expect the low buck guys to compete with these budgets?"
In everyday life? "I think we should get a raise at our job. We're just getting by on our wages."
"You make how much? You should be happy you still have a job."
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The problem with your analogy is that those players in the 4 major sports do not pay to play. And actually it's quite the opposit, they we paid quite well to play
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November 13, 2023 at
05:26:56 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: tenter on November 13 2023 at 02:43:21 PM
These top heavy $100,000+ to win races are killing the local and regional teams. Imagine what it would be like to pay $25,000 to win , and spread the rest of the $75,000 back throughout the A & B main fields. You could add $2000 onto every other starter in the A-main ($46,000) and then have $28,000 left to pay from 5th on back in the B-main.
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NOT. If I could click my fingers, big paying shows would be invite only, Low budget weekend raceres are just in the way.
Right now there is about 40 drivers that would qualify for an invite IMO.
Everyone needs to work their way up.
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November 13, 2023 at
05:27:02 PM
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This message was edited on
November 13, 2023 at
05:31:00 PM by Johnny Utah
I was referencing fans of the big four sports saying those things, not the players.
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November 13, 2023 at
05:45:47 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: TMATT on November 13 2023 at 05:26:56 PM
NOT. If I could click my fingers, big paying shows would be invite only, Low budget weekend raceres are just in the way.
Right now there is about 40 drivers that would qualify for an invite IMO.
Everyone needs to work their way up.
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How do you do that if you don't get to race against them?
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November 13, 2023 at
05:47:35 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: BStrawser26 on November 13 2023 at 02:54:35 PM
True socialism if I ever saw it.
The bmain cars get tow and not 28 grand worth either. That is way too high. You are now penalizing the cars that run good.
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Cool . Then eventually we wouldn't even have races to go to. You need to stfu.
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November 13, 2023 at
06:22:33 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: BStrawser26 on November 13 2023 at 02:54:35 PM
True socialism if I ever saw it.
The bmain cars get tow and not 28 grand worth either. That is way too high. You are now penalizing the cars that run good.
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Silly rhetoric
This has nothing to do with "socialism". Socialism means public ownership of the means of production.
This is about making a competitive, totally capitalist sport more fair, & keeping low budget teams afloat
Similar to keeping Walmart from killing Mom & Pop stores
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November 13, 2023 at
06:32:13 PM
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If the racers don't like or like the money distribution that is their decisions. I just want to see good racing for the admission price. Decent food and prices of it. Nothing worse than expensive crappy food.
I like how the IRA 410 runs their races or have in the past.
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November 13, 2023 at
07:20:20 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: revjimk on November 13 2023 at 06:22:33 PM
Silly rhetoric
This has nothing to do with "socialism". Socialism means public ownership of the means of production.
This is about making a competitive, totally capitalist sport more fair, & keeping low budget teams afloat
Similar to keeping Walmart from killing Mom & Pop stores
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Socialism is not just about production but also distribution of resources. Any purse that more equally disburses the money over the field has socialist principles. Its not necessarily a bad thing as true capitalism is survival of the fittest and would lead to 10 car fields.
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November 13, 2023 at
07:35:53 PM
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Right, socialism would be the Eldora Million paying 100 cars $10,000 each no matter where they finished, but the winner could get a cool trophy maybe?
Looking at the posts here lately, it would need to be $10 to get in. 50cent pizza, quarter drinks, $1.00 beer and the show needs to start at 7 and be done by 9pm. Tony could just make up the difference out of pocket.
If port/lincoln charged $15 to get in, then they would not gain but 9 "fans", because everyone else can come up with the extra $5, just buy 1 less starbucks, 1 less big mac or 1 less case of bud light for the week there sparky.
Then they drop the purse the same 25% because less gate money. Then 18 cars show up for $3000 to win and $300 to start, then fans get to see 3 heats and an A main (but hey OUT BY 9PM!!!!) then fans say that aint worth it and less fans come and it spirals from there.
Port and Grove paid out over $800,000 to 410 sprints this year (even with the rainouts). That don't happen at a $12 local show ticket, or a $25 WoO ticket price. If you don't care about the purse, you are ignorant to what gets cars to the track.
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November 13, 2023 at
08:01:43 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Cardshark24 on November 13 2023 at 01:05:48 PM
I am hearing that the high limit is doing everything the exact same as the outlaws. The only thing different is the choose cone. Same structure, pay outs, points fund, starting pay, etc. That is just silly to me. I was at first, very excited about high limit purchasing the All Stars. Then I hear no shows at Knoxville, and using the outlaw format.
That just makes 0 sense. That is telling me the high limit series, thinks the WRG group and outlaw format is the best. Come on high limit, you can do much better. The true All Star format was perfect. It made for much better racing! I watched 90% of the outlaws races, and 80% of the all star races in the last 3 years. Overall, the best racing was the all stars, hand down.
I think competition is good, I think it could improve both series. I think it is good for the fans. There once was a day, where the outlaw drivers were the best. Now, I could see drivers like Brad Sweet, Tyler C, Rico A, Anthony M, Brent M, cherry picking the outlaws, kinda funny actually. When I was a kid, 80's and early 90's I can never recall a outlaw driver not finishing on the podium. A few weeks back 1 night at Charlotte, top 5 didn't even have an outlaw driver in it. Maybe 1 snuck in the last lap, maybe not. I also remember a time an outlaw ticket was 25.00. The winner got paid 10k. Now an outlaw ticket is what 47 plus? Outlaws paid 10k to win on average in 23. I have seen a post from McKenna Haase wishing tracks would put that huge winners share, more towards the whole field. I see her point there, but that is what makes the 2 series beneficial for the low buck racer, who now has a chance of making the shows, when half of the drivers are competing in either series.
if high limit is going to do everything the same as the outlaws, I have lost interest already. If they are going to charge the same as WRG, to host events, no thanks. If this becomes a war with Flo, and DIRTVision, I will boycott both. The amazing times we live in, there are results posted immediately on Facebook and other sources, I am happy with that. I hope in 25 high limit and knoxville can meet in the middle. I am hoping folks from high limit can tell me I got everything all wrong, and that they will be different, and try to be better.
Jeff M
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You just joined Hoseheads today to sound exactly like afew of the anti- High Limit people who have be posting the same thing for a couple weeks now? That's odd.
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November 13, 2023 at
09:49:56 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Cardshark24 on November 13 2023 at 01:05:48 PM
I am hearing that the high limit is doing everything the exact same as the outlaws. The only thing different is the choose cone. Same structure, pay outs, points fund, starting pay, etc. That is just silly to me. I was at first, very excited about high limit purchasing the All Stars. Then I hear no shows at Knoxville, and using the outlaw format.
That just makes 0 sense. That is telling me the high limit series, thinks the WRG group and outlaw format is the best. Come on high limit, you can do much better. The true All Star format was perfect. It made for much better racing! I watched 90% of the outlaws races, and 80% of the all star races in the last 3 years. Overall, the best racing was the all stars, hand down.
I think competition is good, I think it could improve both series. I think it is good for the fans. There once was a day, where the outlaw drivers were the best. Now, I could see drivers like Brad Sweet, Tyler C, Rico A, Anthony M, Brent M, cherry picking the outlaws, kinda funny actually. When I was a kid, 80's and early 90's I can never recall a outlaw driver not finishing on the podium. A few weeks back 1 night at Charlotte, top 5 didn't even have an outlaw driver in it. Maybe 1 snuck in the last lap, maybe not. I also remember a time an outlaw ticket was 25.00. The winner got paid 10k. Now an outlaw ticket is what 47 plus? Outlaws paid 10k to win on average in 23. I have seen a post from McKenna Haase wishing tracks would put that huge winners share, more towards the whole field. I see her point there, but that is what makes the 2 series beneficial for the low buck racer, who now has a chance of making the shows, when half of the drivers are competing in either series.
if high limit is going to do everything the same as the outlaws, I have lost interest already. If they are going to charge the same as WRG, to host events, no thanks. If this becomes a war with Flo, and DIRTVision, I will boycott both. The amazing times we live in, there are results posted immediately on Facebook and other sources, I am happy with that. I hope in 25 high limit and knoxville can meet in the middle. I am hoping folks from high limit can tell me I got everything all wrong, and that they will be different, and try to be better.
Jeff M
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The Copycat series wants transparency from WRG and to share the wealth and then they adopt the same rules??
This is like throwing your Boss under the bus because he makes more money then you and you want his job!!
This attempted Hardball is Not a good thing for fans!!! P.S. This time next year remember to ask how much they make from Flo!!
All we get is 2 split up series and a stupid dice roll. Thanks
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November 13, 2023 at
10:58:01 PM
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Murphy,
I actually was one of the first original posters here. Yes, been a few years since I have been on. I actually had to make a new user name, as I forgot my password, and don't have that email address anymore from back then. My original user name is poker_player_24. I also am not one against high limit. If anything, more for high limit than WRG. At the end of the day, just a fan of sprint cars, and we all could win as fans, as long as WRG and high limit play their cards right. .......... did ya see what I did there? If they play there cards right hahaha
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November 13, 2023 at
11:34:29 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: egras on November 13 2023 at 02:57:54 PM
Your first paragraph "exactly the same as the outlaws" is incorrect. Maybe this year may look okay, but let's talk again in 2025. If there are more than 3 High Limit teams that make every show, I'll be shocked. Gonna need a contract with their drivers. Eventually exclusive rights to those drivers. That should give everyone the series they were looking for to dethrone the Outlaws------which will be exactly the same as the Outlaws. Not saying that's what Kyle and Brad want, but if all of the Outlaw haters want a replacement, it's gonna have to look exactly the same in the long run.
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You keep saying that and I know you believe it but it's not necessarily true. You gotta remember there's more than one way to skin a cat. NASCAR, F1 Indy Car and to my knowledge Late Models don't have exclusivity rules (if there is any kind of rules like that, usually it's the car owner's decision). I'll be interested to see what they do. There's a lot of potential for a NEW series, and the way they conduct business. But as I said before, history has shown your not going to beat the WOO by doing exactly what they do. Flo makes this interesting, depending on how that whole model works, it could change a lot of things. For 40 years no other football leagues could compete with the NFL and the AFL came in and basically beat them at their own game.
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November 14, 2023 at
05:52:18 AM
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This message was edited on
November 14, 2023 at
05:59:55 AM by BStrawser26
Reply to:
Posted By: tenter on November 13 2023 at 05:47:35 PM
Cool . Then eventually we wouldn't even have races to go to. You need to stfu.
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The winner should get a much bigger amount.....since you know he is the winner! Get your garbage out of here.
Yes the bmain cars more than the winner share of the purse. That is so wrong in so many ways.
Next you are going to want everyone to get a participation trophy. This is too much. LOL!
Let's go Sprint Car Racing!
Knoxville - Best Track In the USA!
Eldora - 2nd Best Track in the USA!
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