Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

It appears that the sanction for the STN in Little Rock is lost but their website is unclear concerning the races in Arizona in November.  The schedule that list the National tour only, does not have any races in Arizona in November.  However, the all areas combined schedule shows races at Arizona Speedway, near Phoenix on Nov 7th and Cocopah, near Yuma on Nov 13th and 14th.  Can someone in the know respond to this.  And if there are no November Arizona races on the schedule, please explain why?  All the other races there have been huge successes and it is one of the most fan and racer friendly facilitys in the country,

talked with emmitt hahn at tampa last week at tampa he told me no more 360s at cocophah

What about the Southwest region, the are also on Cocopah's schedule for the 7th of November and they are 360's?  I talked with Greg Burgess during the Winter heat races and he was looking forward to ASCS National coming back in November.  So, what's the rest of the story, anything like I-30?

It seems as if there are a lot of irregularities in the schedule this year.  No Cocopah, no I 30, no Jackson(NSL), no Oregon, no California?  What gives.  They seem to draw a good crowd and a good field of cars.  Is this just an issue that the schedule was really put together by Tommy Estes, and with him gone it is struggling?

When Lonnie & Tommy were let go was a sign that ASCS only cared about $ not what should matter. Im sure all the other tracks were told sweet nothings like i30 thus the big change in their schedule

Last year at I-30, we had 31 cars for a weekly show the week before an Ascs race. The Ascs race brought us 34. Did those 3 cars justify spending 5x the money that was the week before when there MIGHT have been an extra 150 people in the stands? And, the weekly show the week before featured much better racing. 

as far as answering the original question, I'll let you read into my post what you wish. 

There is no replacement for cubic displacement 

The ASCS has made it perfectly clear what their motivations are.  It is to make money, at any and all costs, with very little to no regard to the racers, owners or promoters. 

 The sanction fees, head porting rule irregularities, aluminum block talk is just the latest examples. 

I wonder how upset everyone is going to be when they find out ASCS is going to LS1 motors.  Emmett Hahn and Lanny Edwards have already built and dynoed one at Jimmy Allards Machine Shop in Texas.  It'll be a shame when the Hahn's tell us all to go throw away our current 360's and start over fresh with new and improved LS1's!  I personally will quit and buy a lake house, and let someone else pay all the Hahn's bills! 

Does the decission by Cocopah to run the 410 Winter Heat series have anything to do with ASCS not scheduling there?  Is it one of those deals like "If you run that series or sanctioning body, forget about us coming back? 

Wasn't it just a month or two ago that Hahn's claimed to have saved sprint car racing in America on Dave Despain's new show?

Dad and I thought it was a hilarious statement considering ASCS crashed and burned hard in the Southeast while USCS keeps getting stronger and stronger.  Then we thought it would be hilarious to be in the same room as Hahn's when he tells all the 410 guys in Harrisburg, PA he's the reason sprint car racing still exists in the good ole USA.

Pete Walton for Hall of Fame 2016!!!

Brandon McLain
United Sprint Car Series Driver
2014 Season
National Rookie of the Year!
National Points - 8th
Southern Points - 3rd
Asphalt Points - 3rd
18 Races, 3 Top 5's, 14 Top 10's

I don't think that's it, the ASCS runs at tracks that run many other sanctions (including other 360 sanctions)....but who knows.

I'm pretty sure ASCS and the 410 race are not connected in any way. The 410 race was unsanctioned so there would have been no conflict of interest with ASCS. Also, what many don't get is the tracks allow different sanctioning bodies to come to their track. The sanctioning bodies don't make the call as to where they race. They very well might have wanted to come back, but they also charge thousands of dollars depending on the agreement in purse money and sanctioning fees just to show up there. When the books are balanced and you can run a local 360 show for 10k and make 3k at the end of the night, why risk 30k to bring a national traveling series in hopes you'll break even when the lights go off and the trailers head to the next track? I don't see the ASCS at Placerville coming back to Placerville. Have you seen the extra seating they added for the Outlaw show? They most likely need to sell the place out to break even or they wouldn't have added those seats. Not every national series is an automatice money maker for the track they go to.

While I agree with the PA portion of your post, let's not get carried a away with the Pete Walton and USBS stuff. He fills a full schedule true enough, but his formula for success is to have shows at places that don't normally see sprints with the exception of west memphis and little rock. That's why those folks don't mind paying $20 To see 15-20 cars with only 2 or 3 of them being "quality cars."  Basically, his series' success is based on the PT Barnum model. If he were to take that stuff anywhere  but where he does, he'd be laughed out of town. 

The closest walton will ever get to the HOF is if he buys a ticket... Or if he has the last touring 360 series... Which is possible at the rate the Ascs is going.

305's are the herpes of sprint cars

What I remember from Dave Despain's show was that Despain quoted Humpy Wheeler as stating that Emmett Hahn saved sprint car racing.   Hahn did agree with the quote though.   ASCS was a good thing at first, but apparently he still thinks that it's a great deal cost wise because the 360s go longer between rebuilds.   He is apparently too blind to see that the cost has gotten way too far out of hand.   

If you think we only have two to three quality cars here in the Southeast, then you are throwing the whole URC series under the bus.  In the last two years, we've had our USCS vs URC challenge, and right now USCS are 3-0.  Also, dont throw out the hometrack argument because no one in the USCS ever races at these tracks regularly other than when Pete's circus comes to town.

Pete's circus lasted a lot longer than Hahn's circus.  He got laughed out of town in his 360 deal and 305 deal.  Apparently, Emmett is only good at promoting sprints were sprints are popular.  Much harder to walk into enemy territory and convince fans to spend an extra $5 on something they could care less about. 

Brandon McLain
United Sprint Car Series Driver
2014 Season
National Rookie of the Year!
National Points - 8th
Southern Points - 3rd
Asphalt Points - 3rd
18 Races, 3 Top 5's, 14 Top 10's

I just looked at ASCS rules and they make no mention of LS1 engines being legal to run. Besides, what wrong about LS1 engines - if they used them as a sealed motor it would cut costs - all i read and hear about 360s is they getting too damn expensive to run. Might as well run a 410 motor for what a competitive 360 costs.

Honestly the LS platform would more than likely be cheaper and make just as if not more HP if they people stayed realistic about the motor builds and mandated using many factory parts. Force factory unaltered head castings. Use 6.0 iron blocks and let them bore me up to about 372-375 cubes so you have some clean up room in the blocks being the stock bore and stroke they are around 366.  

The problem with switching wholesale platforms is you basically junk a bunch of motors doing the conversion which if you paid for them as a team owner I'm sure you wouldn't be happy about.  

Because I'm just like most everyone else racing ASCS 360's right now.  I have 3 motors.  What do you want me to do with my 3 motors?  They will now be obsolete, and basically worthless becuase you can't run them anywhere; so my best bet will be to take them to the local landfill and dispose of them!  Now lets assume we can build this LS motor for $25k and produces 650hp.  Now let me spend another $75k for the greater good of ASCS racing to get these life saving LS motors.  No thanks!  Like I said I'll quit and buy a lake house.  I'd go 410 racing way before I'd consider starting over with LS motors.  The problem even with the LS motors is they will not be tech'ed.  ASCS is too lazy and doesn't understand the dynamics of a motor to tech them every night.  Same scenario we have right now.  This is why they opened the head rule up.  Everyone was already cheating, they didn't want to tech or DQ people so lets just make it legal.  LS motors will be out of hand almost immediately even if you seal them.  Good luck to all, and best wishes!!!

Tommy Estes is GREATLY missed! 

When Tommie and lonnie left the Ascs, many of us knew, right then, that they were irreplaceable. I don't pretend to know, nor do I want to know, why they left, but the Ascs hasn't been the same. Can't fill a full schedule, unkept promises (allegedly), scheduling conflicts within there own schedules, and costs that no longer offer an advantage of the 360 over 410. There is no way, if I were a car owner, I'd race with the Ascs when the NSL is an option. JMO.

There is no replacement for cubic displacement 

Cocopah made the last minute call not to have ASCS back. With 67 cars at East Bay I think ASCS is alive and well....no series is perfect! 

Saturday night highlights from East Bay

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pr3Ck9lqGuU

Thursday night highlights from East Bay

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugVn07XrgAQ

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