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Topic: Whatever happened to?
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Page 49 of 101 of 2005 replies
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February 20, 2009 at
10:15:21 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Bkcr on February 20 2009 at 08:01:21 PM
Luther,The Jelly car #99 that Harold had so much success with in the Mid '60s, was it a 4-bar space frame chassis? I rember Harold saying that it had more side bite than any car that he ever drove, was this car ahead of it's time and what ever happened to it ?
Ray
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That #99 car is still at Jelly's shop as of last year! That is what he told me on the phone. Albeit, it is now in pieces, waiting to be reassembled someday, but it is still in Jelly's possession.
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February 20, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: rustyrail on February 20 2009 at 08:45:11 PM
Yah, but for a bachelor, think what a neat piece it is to hang on the living room wall. Those sort of things really impress the ladies. LOL Love me, love my race car.
A couple of hints for eBay...check the rating of the seller. If 98-100, probably a good seller and then only need to check the pictures close, or ask the seller questions. The "good" sellers might even have a return policy, or will work with you if you are totally unhappy, so to keep their good rating.
Don't let the freight bug bite you. That $40 transmission isn't so cheap if it costs $100 to get to your door.
Luther
Ackerman has been around a long time. One of the few things that stuck with me from spending 5 years at Kansas State. That was in the day when a calculator was a Post VersaLog(look up slide rule) and you solved your problems on a drafting table, not a computer.
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Women and car parts and cars have ALWAYS conflicted in my life. For a short time in my life I had a few girlfriends and ONE vehicle. But I have always liked the idea of ONE woman and a LOT of cars! Seems like every girlfriend I have at least 2 projects, and 2 vehicles to RUN THE WHEELS OFF LOOKING FOR PARTS TO FINISH THE PROJECTS WITH. Add that up with the problem of actually selling anything, throw in the years, and it gets cluttered around here. In a town that does not seem to have any customers for what I'm into.
The closer to getting married I am, the closer it seems that I will have to be to sell said projects for a dinette set, or something like that.
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February 21, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: brian26 on February 20 2009 at 05:35:31 PM
JD, isn't this an old Stanton super?
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I was told by either Bob or John that this car was a Barnett. Man this car would run its guts out at Tulsa for 19 1/2 laps then either blow up or break something, week after week.
The older I get the faster I use to be
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February 21, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: rustyrail on February 20 2009 at 02:02:52 PM
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=180329342269
For someone who has the bug to build a car. Is an 86", non down tube roller. No reserve and price is right. Stretch out to 100", get a seat and motor and go racing. Looks to be lots of good parts. Steering and brake system are all intact. And, not that far away.
Luther...That steering is called Ackerman. Chevy used it in their advertising in the 40's, but there are still some vehicles that don't know about it, or don't use it. If the tie rod is behind the axle, the ends are inside the king pin. If the tie rod is in front of the axle, the ends are outside the kingpin, but always on that center of rear axle--king pin line.
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Ackerman is not a type of steering but rather the degree one front tire is as apposed to the angle of the other front tire when making a turn.
Ackerman Steering and Racing Oval TracksMany racers are becoming aware of Ackerman Steering geometry and are concerned with how it influences their race cars. Conventional Ackerman Steering was developed around 1800 AD. Yes, 1800, not 1900. The Ackerman concept is to have all four wheels rolling around a common point during a turn.
The example above shows that the inside front tire must turn a larger number of degrees than the outside front tire for this principle to work.
Most short tracks (oval tracks) have a corner radius of 150'+/-. For a race car that has a 108" wheel base and 60" width, the inside tire would need to turn 3.4 degrees and the outside tire would need to turn 3.3 degrees to have Ackerman Steering. In other words, the inside tire needs to turn 1/10th of a degree more than the outside tire in order to fulfill the Ackerman requirement for this car and corner.
However, at racing speeds, tires develop what is known as slip angle. Despite the name "slip angle" it has nothing to do with slipping or sliding. Instead, it describes the flexing or twisting of the tire's contact patch. It's not unusual for racing tires to develop 6 +/- degrees of slip angle before they loose traction. DOT (street) tires can develop as much as 10 degrees of slip angle before they loose traction.
Due to the magnitude of flex (slip angle) in the tires, that tenth of a degree steering difference mentioned earlier is negligible. So, when it comes to tuning your race car, take conventional Ackerman off the list of concerns. For more information related to this subject see Slip Angles and Handling.
The older I get the faster I use to be
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February 21, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: Bkcr on February 20 2009 at 08:01:21 PM
Luther,The Jelly car #99 that Harold had so much success with in the Mid '60s, was it a 4-bar space frame chassis? I rember Harold saying that it had more side bite than any car that he ever drove, was this car ahead of it's time and what ever happened to it ?
Ray
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The Jelly #99 car. I saw it run once in the mid 60s & the rear hubs were home made on an open tube by Jelly. I think Jelly told me the rear hubs were made from large gears from a tractor. They were machined out inside to fit a non tapered tube axle and bolted to the axle. The wheels were bolt on with lug bolts. I don't know about the suspension.
Luther
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February 21, 2009 at
09:26:29 AM
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Reply to:
Posted By: rustyrail on February 20 2009 at 08:45:11 PM
Yah, but for a bachelor, think what a neat piece it is to hang on the living room wall. Those sort of things really impress the ladies. LOL Love me, love my race car.
A couple of hints for eBay...check the rating of the seller. If 98-100, probably a good seller and then only need to check the pictures close, or ask the seller questions. The "good" sellers might even have a return policy, or will work with you if you are totally unhappy, so to keep their good rating.
Don't let the freight bug bite you. That $40 transmission isn't so cheap if it costs $100 to get to your door.
Luther
Ackerman has been around a long time. One of the few things that stuck with me from spending 5 years at Kansas State. That was in the day when a calculator was a Post VersaLog(look up slide rule) and you solved your problems on a drafting table, not a computer.
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Rustyrail,...5 years at Kansas State in Manhattan sounds exciting. I ran the Topeka 1/2 mile track in Topeka the 71, 72, 73 & 74 season. I was responsible for everything in the pits. Race program, insurance, track conditions and payed the racing purse & help. I discontinud the weekly shows after July because of the fuel problems. The attendence dropped & alcohol for sprints went from 25cents to $1.50, if you could find it. Needless to say, the car count dropped to about a dozen.
Luther
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February 21, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: Sprint97 on February 21 2009 at 09:26:29 AM
Rustyrail,...5 years at Kansas State in Manhattan sounds exciting. I ran the Topeka 1/2 mile track in Topeka the 71, 72, 73 & 74 season. I was responsible for everything in the pits. Race program, insurance, track conditions and payed the racing purse & help. I discontinud the weekly shows after July because of the fuel problems. The attendence dropped & alcohol for sprints went from 25cents to $1.50, if you could find it. Needless to say, the car count dropped to about a dozen.
Luther
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Luther
Looking back, the time in Manhattan was the good old days. Just didn't seem like it at the time, living on mac and cheese, and weiners. Other than Belleville, about the only races I got to were at the drag strip. Moved to Salina in '73, and spent time at their little track, but by then, they were into stock cars. In '78, I moved to Perry, Ok, to work for Ditch Witch. Was dealing with job, wife, 2 kids, and didn't have a clue to what was going on at Enid, OkC, Wichita, or Tulsa. Talk about being in the middle of the action. As with alot of people, it was always on my mind, but tried to do the right thing(job, family, shear boredom). I would pick up a copy of Open Wheel when I could find it, but that was about it. Had gotten into flying in Salina, so bought a plane while in Perry, which was my only hobby for years. Finally had enough of the corporate world, and left Perry about 6 months before oil came crashing down in '81. Have been in northern Kansas since. 10 years ago, had a major life change(divorce), so decided I had lived long enough for other people, and was time to live for me. Bought a Harley and tried to make up for lost time. Spend a week in Sturgis, and have taken several road trips. Picked up my rail chassis out of a pasture in '03, and got it running in '06. Found a real good group of people with KAR and try to make as many of their events as the farm allows. Have a 100" car I am working on now, and trying to keep from bidding on a sprint car on eBay. LOL
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February 21, 2009 at
09:22:05 PM
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Saw on the news Round Up Pizza was robbed and the owner was shot and in serious condition.
John Stewart
Retro Racing Custom Model Cars
405.922.6163
[email protected]
Oklahoma City, OK
Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/pages/Retro-
Racing-Custom-Model-Cars/235624429834292#!/pages/Retro-
Racing-Custom-Model-Cars/23562442983429
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February 22, 2009 at
07:57:13 AM
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Reply to:
Posted By: rustyrail on February 21 2009 at 02:00:40 PM
Luther
Looking back, the time in Manhattan was the good old days. Just didn't seem like it at the time, living on mac and cheese, and weiners. Other than Belleville, about the only races I got to were at the drag strip. Moved to Salina in '73, and spent time at their little track, but by then, they were into stock cars. In '78, I moved to Perry, Ok, to work for Ditch Witch. Was dealing with job, wife, 2 kids, and didn't have a clue to what was going on at Enid, OkC, Wichita, or Tulsa. Talk about being in the middle of the action. As with alot of people, it was always on my mind, but tried to do the right thing(job, family, shear boredom). I would pick up a copy of Open Wheel when I could find it, but that was about it. Had gotten into flying in Salina, so bought a plane while in Perry, which was my only hobby for years. Finally had enough of the corporate world, and left Perry about 6 months before oil came crashing down in '81. Have been in northern Kansas since. 10 years ago, had a major life change(divorce), so decided I had lived long enough for other people, and was time to live for me. Bought a Harley and tried to make up for lost time. Spend a week in Sturgis, and have taken several road trips. Picked up my rail chassis out of a pasture in '03, and got it running in '06. Found a real good group of people with KAR and try to make as many of their events as the farm allows. Have a 100" car I am working on now, and trying to keep from bidding on a sprint car on eBay. LOL
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Rustyrail,....I tried to find one of the cars I built to restore. Have chased several to scrap piles . One has been restored & is in the Minneapolis area. There are pictures of it on the link here that has pictures of my cars. One I havn't been able to trace after it was sold to someone in Hastings, Nebraska. It is the #10 car I built & was an exact duplicate of the #12 except it had a champ quick change with a housing rear end with swival cages over the tube housing rear axle and rear cross bars set up like an open tube suspension. It had a cross spring front. Rear wheels were wide 5 pattern & the front were Ford spindles & hubs with 5 lug bolts. The reason they bought the car was it had a spring front & rules at Hastings allowed a larger wing on spring front cars.
Brennfoder from Nebraska took pictures of it a few years ago to see if anyone could remember it but I never heard from him. It is probably on somebodys back 40 rusting away!
Luther
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February 22, 2009 at
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This message was edited on
February 22, 2009 at
12:20:39 PM by rustyrail
Reply to:
Posted By: Sprint97 on February 22 2009 at 07:57:13 AM
Rustyrail,....I tried to find one of the cars I built to restore. Have chased several to scrap piles . One has been restored & is in the Minneapolis area. There are pictures of it on the link here that has pictures of my cars. One I havn't been able to trace after it was sold to someone in Hastings, Nebraska. It is the #10 car I built & was an exact duplicate of the #12 except it had a champ quick change with a housing rear end with swival cages over the tube housing rear axle and rear cross bars set up like an open tube suspension. It had a cross spring front. Rear wheels were wide 5 pattern & the front were Ford spindles & hubs with 5 lug bolts. The reason they bought the car was it had a spring front & rules at Hastings allowed a larger wing on spring front cars.
Brennfoder from Nebraska took pictures of it a few years ago to see if anyone could remember it but I never heard from him. It is probably on somebodys back 40 rusting away!
Luther
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Luther
Frank B. was at the KAR meet in Norton a few years ago. Had a good talk with him, and got a business card. Guess he still has a shop in Lincoln. As far as I know, he hasn't been back to that show, and haven't heard from him since. I will keep my eyes and ears open, to see if anything like that shows up. We are getting more interest, and have gotten more involved with the MVVRA guys in eastern Iowa and the CVRO guys in Colorado, so see a wider selection of cars and people at shows. Your 10 car sounds like something that is different enough to stand out, unless someone changed out the rear for a live axle, or trashed it. So many of the cars were salvaged when they got older, and what was left was crushed. Now that there is interest in them, real hard and expensive to re-create. The 100" car I am working on was built in the early 70's in Indiana as a pavement sprinter. It has wide 5s on both ends. At one time, it had Safety Racing rims, but those are long since gone. Ones that show up on Ebay are higher than later Weld aluminum rims. So, for now, it will have the steel rims that were on it when I got it, or Welds, when I can find them without bead locks.
Did you mark or tag your chassis? Know of a couple of sprint frames sitting in a pasture, but I think both are cross bar fronts. Also know of a super rotting away in a tree row. Came from the Gothenburg/Lexington area. Has a space frame made from 1" and 1 1/2"sq tube. Owner won't sell.
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February 22, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: rustyrail on February 22 2009 at 12:11:09 PM
Luther
Frank B. was at the KAR meet in Norton a few years ago. Had a good talk with him, and got a business card. Guess he still has a shop in Lincoln. As far as I know, he hasn't been back to that show, and haven't heard from him since. I will keep my eyes and ears open, to see if anything like that shows up. We are getting more interest, and have gotten more involved with the MVVRA guys in eastern Iowa and the CVRO guys in Colorado, so see a wider selection of cars and people at shows. Your 10 car sounds like something that is different enough to stand out, unless someone changed out the rear for a live axle, or trashed it. So many of the cars were salvaged when they got older, and what was left was crushed. Now that there is interest in them, real hard and expensive to re-create. The 100" car I am working on was built in the early 70's in Indiana as a pavement sprinter. It has wide 5s on both ends. At one time, it had Safety Racing rims, but those are long since gone. Ones that show up on Ebay are higher than later Weld aluminum rims. So, for now, it will have the steel rims that were on it when I got it, or Welds, when I can find them without bead locks.
Did you mark or tag your chassis? Know of a couple of sprint frames sitting in a pasture, but I think both are cross bar fronts. Also know of a super rotting away in a tree row. Came from the Gothenburg/Lexington area. Has a space frame made from 1" and 1 1/2"sq tube. Owner won't sell.
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Rustyr,...The car is made of 1 1/2 X .125 wall moly tubing. If it still has the front spring set up, the top rail turns down in front of the cage & welds to the bottom tube. It then comes up in front of the headers & continues to the front cross member. It also has a horizontal tube close under the headers that connect the to tubes together. That was so you could lift the engine with the headers on & remove the valve covers easier for setting the valves. The cross brace in the back roll bar had a bracket added for a pad. That was added after Stan Brofsky cracked a neck vertebra in the 74 crash at Knoxville. The car frames were identical. If it was changed to a 4 bar, the down tubes are probably still there but another tube replaceing the top rail to entend out to the torison tubes.
I did not number any of the frames.......Luther
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February 22, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: Sprint97 on February 22 2009 at 03:36:12 PM
Rustyr,...The car is made of 1 1/2 X .125 wall moly tubing. If it still has the front spring set up, the top rail turns down in front of the cage & welds to the bottom tube. It then comes up in front of the headers & continues to the front cross member. It also has a horizontal tube close under the headers that connect the to tubes together. That was so you could lift the engine with the headers on & remove the valve covers easier for setting the valves. The cross brace in the back roll bar had a bracket added for a pad. That was added after Stan Brofsky cracked a neck vertebra in the 74 crash at Knoxville. The car frames were identical. If it was changed to a 4 bar, the down tubes are probably still there but another tube replaceing the top rail to entend out to the torison tubes.
I did not number any of the frames.......Luther
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Luther, Who was the best driver that you ever saw? Could you rate the drivers that raced for and against you like David did for the NCRA drivers?
Ray
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February 23, 2009 at
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Brian and sprintcar21n, That car was a Stanton car built in Arizona, use to hang around and help Bob and John with that car it was in 77,78,79 , It was I believe the last several years that Jerry Barnett worked for Stanton in Phoenix,Az. and then came to Dallas and him and Ewell started building Barnett cars in the Bldg. in front of the Bowl I believe in 79 or 80.
Your right Sprintcar21n Bob use to come to Tulsa and lead the A and scatter a motor. It was something but Ewell came back again and again, even had motors guys up Tulsa way wanting to build some powerplants for him back then , one of them was Ken Wright, but I guess it did not work out.
I have lots of pics of the white 18 as well as a sister car built for David Flanagan who was from Dallas area and it was an exact same chassis and paint job and lettering job only it was no. 81 , Ewell drove it several times at Lawton to help Flanagan figure some things out with it and won with it the second time he drove it at Lawton.I got some pics of that exact night.
The car may have been built by Jerry Barnett while working for Stanton but it came from Stanton's shop.
rustyrail , thanks for the lesson on buying on ebay.
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February 23, 2009 at
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This message was edited on
February 23, 2009 at
08:36:15 AM by Sprint97
Reply to:
Posted By: Bkcr on February 22 2009 at 05:45:12 PM
Luther, Who was the best driver that you ever saw? Could you rate the drivers that raced for and against you like David did for the NCRA drivers?
Ray
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Ray,...I had, by far the best performance with Ray Lee Goodwin. He started driving for me at the beginning of the 66 season in the T Coupe car. It was also, by far the best car I had to that point. I put a lot more into building that car. Even degreeing the cam to manfactures specs. He knew more about setting up a car, right or left rear weight, tire stagger & air pressure. He was around Jud Larson in the early 60s while Jud ran supers out of Kansas City. Jud was the best on dirt. (Jud sit in my car once, adjusted the seat belts, then got out to take a better ride. Probably 10 minutes !! )
The first season for the T Coupe car, Ray Lee finished 1st, 2nd or 3rd 90 times in the time trials, dash, heat & features. The 2nd year I sold it in late June & Ray Lee continued to drive it until I got the next car built (a 4 bar AJ Watson) and won the next 8 features he ran for the new owner. We won 3 track championships in the 2 years. He drove for me off & on through the 69 season. He was trying to go USAC & would go run all the races he could. I was not interested in going USAC.
Jack Belk was fearless & always finished well, but he was not familuar with weight & tire stagger & air pressure. He had driven mostly stock cars & 1 super. If I had him after Ray Lee and could set the car up as I learned from Ray Lee, he could have been as good. Jack lived in Joplin & I lived in Drexel which was a 100 miles north of him The KC, Topeka & Knoxville circuit was closer for me & the Tulsa, Joplin and that area was closest for him.
Gorden Woolley drove my car one week end In 64, Friday at Eagle,NB, Sat at Knoxville & Sunday at Bloomfield, IA. I think we had 2 seconds & a 3rd which was exceptional considering the car!
I liked Grady Wade & was around him quite a lot. He drove my 68/69 car twice & won both times going away. He was running the NCRA circuit & would show up at Topeka once in awhile. I would see him at IMCA fair dates. I sold my car at the end of the 69 season. I had 7 different drivers in 69 & won with 5 of them. I was traveling about 800 miles from Friday afternoon until midnight Sunday & working on the car Mon, Tue & Wed nights so deceided to scale back.
I did consider fielding a mile dirt car (Champ Dirt Car) in USAC because they only ran 6 to 8 races a season & they usually were on Holiday week ends. I got the Postmasters job where I lived in December of 1966 & did not want to jeopardize the future retirement benifits.
Who is the best I ever saw ?? I thought AJ Foyt was the best during my time. On dirt, asphalt, in a midget, sprint, Champ Dirt or Indy car. Greg Weld told me that he & Foyt were talking about the upcoming Hut 100 at the Indianoplis Fairgrounds in the early 70s. Greg bet Foyt $100 he could not beat Jan Operman in the race. He said Foyt's sprint car was in storage. He got it out & brought it to the race. Foyt won the first 50 lap, inverted, & won the 2nd 50 lap race. Greg had to pay.
I probably had a dozen drivers during that time & I'm sure some could have one very well. Some only drove the local 1/4 mile tracks the first 3 years & it is had to rate them. Sometimes, I wished I had kept the car & pick dates like Chet Wilson did. His win percentage rate of wins is probably as high as anybodys.
See what happens when you ask me an opion or question !!....Luther
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February 23, 2009 at
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Had this pic for a while, what's your impression?
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February 23, 2009 at
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Since they are so hard to acquire, I'd like to know how have an axle like this built. The "key" point here is the long continous curve.
One idea is to see if Gambler chassis has a roll bender that could draw the tubing through. I say Gambler because they build custom bikes these days and those guys have to use tubing formed the same way.
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February 23, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: rustyrail on February 22 2009 at 12:11:09 PM
Luther
Frank B. was at the KAR meet in Norton a few years ago. Had a good talk with him, and got a business card. Guess he still has a shop in Lincoln. As far as I know, he hasn't been back to that show, and haven't heard from him since. I will keep my eyes and ears open, to see if anything like that shows up. We are getting more interest, and have gotten more involved with the MVVRA guys in eastern Iowa and the CVRO guys in Colorado, so see a wider selection of cars and people at shows. Your 10 car sounds like something that is different enough to stand out, unless someone changed out the rear for a live axle, or trashed it. So many of the cars were salvaged when they got older, and what was left was crushed. Now that there is interest in them, real hard and expensive to re-create. The 100" car I am working on was built in the early 70's in Indiana as a pavement sprinter. It has wide 5s on both ends. At one time, it had Safety Racing rims, but those are long since gone. Ones that show up on Ebay are higher than later Weld aluminum rims. So, for now, it will have the steel rims that were on it when I got it, or Welds, when I can find them without bead locks.
Did you mark or tag your chassis? Know of a couple of sprint frames sitting in a pasture, but I think both are cross bar fronts. Also know of a super rotting away in a tree row. Came from the Gothenburg/Lexington area. Has a space frame made from 1" and 1 1/2"sq tube. Owner won't sell.
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Nice looking car.
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February 23, 2009 at
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Reply to:
Posted By: jdsprint71 on February 23 2009 at 08:20:37 AM
Brian and sprintcar21n, That car was a Stanton car built in Arizona, use to hang around and help Bob and John with that car it was in 77,78,79 , It was I believe the last several years that Jerry Barnett worked for Stanton in Phoenix,Az. and then came to Dallas and him and Ewell started building Barnett cars in the Bldg. in front of the Bowl I believe in 79 or 80.
Your right Sprintcar21n Bob use to come to Tulsa and lead the A and scatter a motor. It was something but Ewell came back again and again, even had motors guys up Tulsa way wanting to build some powerplants for him back then , one of them was Ken Wright, but I guess it did not work out.
I have lots of pics of the white 18 as well as a sister car built for David Flanagan who was from Dallas area and it was an exact same chassis and paint job and lettering job only it was no. 81 , Ewell drove it several times at Lawton to help Flanagan figure some things out with it and won with it the second time he drove it at Lawton.I got some pics of that exact night.
The car may have been built by Jerry Barnett while working for Stanton but it came from Stanton's shop.
rustyrail , thanks for the lesson on buying on ebay.
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Did you get you a sprint car?? I see it only brought $1525. Someone got a real bargain. Could have parted it out for $4000. There is another one on now....is a Gambler roller that they say has never been on the track, but is a downtube car. Buy it now is only $1550. Is down Luther's way, in Pensacola. I would have jumped on the car in Nebraska, but working on getting a tow truck, so no spare coins. 
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February 23, 2009 at
03:45:15 PM
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Joined:
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12/12/2008
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599
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Reply to:
Posted By: Sprint97 on February 23 2009 at 08:33:26 AM
Ray,...I had, by far the best performance with Ray Lee Goodwin. He started driving for me at the beginning of the 66 season in the T Coupe car. It was also, by far the best car I had to that point. I put a lot more into building that car. Even degreeing the cam to manfactures specs. He knew more about setting up a car, right or left rear weight, tire stagger & air pressure. He was around Jud Larson in the early 60s while Jud ran supers out of Kansas City. Jud was the best on dirt. (Jud sit in my car once, adjusted the seat belts, then got out to take a better ride. Probably 10 minutes !! )
The first season for the T Coupe car, Ray Lee finished 1st, 2nd or 3rd 90 times in the time trials, dash, heat & features. The 2nd year I sold it in late June & Ray Lee continued to drive it until I got the next car built (a 4 bar AJ Watson) and won the next 8 features he ran for the new owner. We won 3 track championships in the 2 years. He drove for me off & on through the 69 season. He was trying to go USAC & would go run all the races he could. I was not interested in going USAC.
Jack Belk was fearless & always finished well, but he was not familuar with weight & tire stagger & air pressure. He had driven mostly stock cars & 1 super. If I had him after Ray Lee and could set the car up as I learned from Ray Lee, he could have been as good. Jack lived in Joplin & I lived in Drexel which was a 100 miles north of him The KC, Topeka & Knoxville circuit was closer for me & the Tulsa, Joplin and that area was closest for him.
Gorden Woolley drove my car one week end In 64, Friday at Eagle,NB, Sat at Knoxville & Sunday at Bloomfield, IA. I think we had 2 seconds & a 3rd which was exceptional considering the car!
I liked Grady Wade & was around him quite a lot. He drove my 68/69 car twice & won both times going away. He was running the NCRA circuit & would show up at Topeka once in awhile. I would see him at IMCA fair dates. I sold my car at the end of the 69 season. I had 7 different drivers in 69 & won with 5 of them. I was traveling about 800 miles from Friday afternoon until midnight Sunday & working on the car Mon, Tue & Wed nights so deceided to scale back.
I did consider fielding a mile dirt car (Champ Dirt Car) in USAC because they only ran 6 to 8 races a season & they usually were on Holiday week ends. I got the Postmasters job where I lived in December of 1966 & did not want to jeopardize the future retirement benifits.
Who is the best I ever saw ?? I thought AJ Foyt was the best during my time. On dirt, asphalt, in a midget, sprint, Champ Dirt or Indy car. Greg Weld told me that he & Foyt were talking about the upcoming Hut 100 at the Indianoplis Fairgrounds in the early 70s. Greg bet Foyt $100 he could not beat Jan Operman in the race. He said Foyt's sprint car was in storage. He got it out & brought it to the race. Foyt won the first 50 lap, inverted, & won the 2nd 50 lap race. Greg had to pay.
I probably had a dozen drivers during that time & I'm sure some could have one very well. Some only drove the local 1/4 mile tracks the first 3 years & it is had to rate them. Sometimes, I wished I had kept the car & pick dates like Chet Wilson did. His win percentage rate of wins is probably as high as anybodys.
See what happens when you ask me an opion or question !!....Luther
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Luther, In 1969 Jack Belk won the Muskogee championship and finished 5th or 6th in the Tulsa standings in the Weiland 37 super. Bob Williams won a 50 lap race at the end of the '69 season at OK. City in this car. This success surprised a lot of people, the 37 car was supposed to be a lot heavier than a lot of it's competitors. It had a closed tube rear and ran the wide 5 wheels. Do you know who built this car and do you have any ideas why it did so well?
Ray
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February 23, 2009 at
04:17:57 PM
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Joined:
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01/21/2007
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Posts:
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337
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Reply to:
Posted By: Sprint97 on February 23 2009 at 08:33:26 AM
Ray,...I had, by far the best performance with Ray Lee Goodwin. He started driving for me at the beginning of the 66 season in the T Coupe car. It was also, by far the best car I had to that point. I put a lot more into building that car. Even degreeing the cam to manfactures specs. He knew more about setting up a car, right or left rear weight, tire stagger & air pressure. He was around Jud Larson in the early 60s while Jud ran supers out of Kansas City. Jud was the best on dirt. (Jud sit in my car once, adjusted the seat belts, then got out to take a better ride. Probably 10 minutes !! )
The first season for the T Coupe car, Ray Lee finished 1st, 2nd or 3rd 90 times in the time trials, dash, heat & features. The 2nd year I sold it in late June & Ray Lee continued to drive it until I got the next car built (a 4 bar AJ Watson) and won the next 8 features he ran for the new owner. We won 3 track championships in the 2 years. He drove for me off & on through the 69 season. He was trying to go USAC & would go run all the races he could. I was not interested in going USAC.
Jack Belk was fearless & always finished well, but he was not familuar with weight & tire stagger & air pressure. He had driven mostly stock cars & 1 super. If I had him after Ray Lee and could set the car up as I learned from Ray Lee, he could have been as good. Jack lived in Joplin & I lived in Drexel which was a 100 miles north of him The KC, Topeka & Knoxville circuit was closer for me & the Tulsa, Joplin and that area was closest for him.
Gorden Woolley drove my car one week end In 64, Friday at Eagle,NB, Sat at Knoxville & Sunday at Bloomfield, IA. I think we had 2 seconds & a 3rd which was exceptional considering the car!
I liked Grady Wade & was around him quite a lot. He drove my 68/69 car twice & won both times going away. He was running the NCRA circuit & would show up at Topeka once in awhile. I would see him at IMCA fair dates. I sold my car at the end of the 69 season. I had 7 different drivers in 69 & won with 5 of them. I was traveling about 800 miles from Friday afternoon until midnight Sunday & working on the car Mon, Tue & Wed nights so deceided to scale back.
I did consider fielding a mile dirt car (Champ Dirt Car) in USAC because they only ran 6 to 8 races a season & they usually were on Holiday week ends. I got the Postmasters job where I lived in December of 1966 & did not want to jeopardize the future retirement benifits.
Who is the best I ever saw ?? I thought AJ Foyt was the best during my time. On dirt, asphalt, in a midget, sprint, Champ Dirt or Indy car. Greg Weld told me that he & Foyt were talking about the upcoming Hut 100 at the Indianoplis Fairgrounds in the early 70s. Greg bet Foyt $100 he could not beat Jan Operman in the race. He said Foyt's sprint car was in storage. He got it out & brought it to the race. Foyt won the first 50 lap, inverted, & won the 2nd 50 lap race. Greg had to pay.
I probably had a dozen drivers during that time & I'm sure some could have one very well. Some only drove the local 1/4 mile tracks the first 3 years & it is had to rate them. Sometimes, I wished I had kept the car & pick dates like Chet Wilson did. His win percentage rate of wins is probably as high as anybodys.
See what happens when you ask me an opion or question !!....Luther
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Luther were you in Topeka in the early 60s when Jack Belk was driving for Al Weiland . Belk beat Jud Larson and they black flaged him with a few laps to go because they thought he was trying to unlap himself..... And after the race they figured out Belk had won the race. The flagman got confused but the score keepers got it right. It was 1961 or 1962 .Just wondered if you were there. I remember it and Al Weiland tells a pretty good tail on it also.
Win as if you are use to it.And lose as if you enjoyed
it for a change.Its hard to get to the top and alot
harder to stay there.
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