Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

How about the idea that once these people become Outlaw that is what they are. Some guys have been traveling so long now that no one cares. How many people get on here and brag about when Kinser, Swindell or Haudenschild win sit behind their PC and say they are from their state? Though it does seem Posse country is pretty loud about making sure people know if a guy who use to race their wins a race traveling. To me it takes away from the PERSON winning.

I understand if it is person is maybe a rookie or they just showed up.

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A healthy diet of dirt in my nachos and beer.

That works both ways. No other region or group of drivers get bashed on this board every time an Outlaw wins a race in the area like the PA teams do. People on this board even bash the PA teams and tracks from 1,000 miles away when there is a rainout. Every time the Outlaws win a race in PA, I can pretty much guarantee there will be a thread started up to bash the locals. Nearly every week, there is a new account that is formed just to bash the PA teams and drivers. There is even one in this thread

YAWN, tell me something I don't know. The Posse win occasionally at the Grove and virtually nowhere else. I think Bill W had it best with the Lincoln stats, Outlaws 28 Posse 4 and yet all the cheerleaders wanna talk about is Fred's or Billy' Brians win and ignore what happened MOST of the time.

Many of the one time winners are only competitive at the Grove and we all know why or at least those with a brain do.

Over the last half dozen years we have had Florida as the best neutral ground for racing and the Posse has been brutalized at East Bay and Volusia. When Lasoski, Saldana, Dollansky and McCarl started to go down there the Posse gravy train was over, done, finished. There is no excuse, no argument, no whining, pure facts that can be looked up. Some have seen this with their own eyes and most (especially uneducated Posse Porch dwellers) just yak blindly about it having never been there or hid for that month while their heros got embarassed, night after night. C'est la vie. Have I mentioned how much life there is AFTER sprint car racing, it would appear some of you need to find it, the sooner the better. BRR, you and Drak could live to be 150 and won't ever get to half the places or half the races I did and I got paid to do so and partied all the way through. Kills ya', doesn't it, lmao. The fact I could care less what happens anymore or for the most part who wins bothers ya' just as much it appears as well, love it. IF I get to a race this year I'll have some fun, maybe not as much as I used to, but heck we all gotta grow up someday. Take It Easy.....

The first time I went to the Grove, I got an ear full from an over weight older guy that told me out how the Outlaws always get whipped up on by the Posse. They never win at the Grove let alone central PA. I mean I got there early and barely got to my seat and there was this guy spewing this propaganda like I knew nothing because I was from California.

This guy was one of those that had an ass so wide, he takes up a seat and an half and a mouth just as big. Suppose this guy I met was BRR?

"Just the facts ma'am", Sgt. Joe Friday, Detective, 
LAPD

wrong again Mulligan - where are your STATS? oh, thats right - they can be looked up?

the STATS abiove show that the Posse wins occaisionally at Kville and they only go there once a year! Win more often on HOME TRACKS than locals in parts unknown.

Lance and Doty nailed you big time and you are a sore loser - those sound bites are priceless.

IF you get to a race this year? living 150 years to end up retired and working two jobs is your problem...too bad you are not allowed to go to the races anymore!

as Rahmer would say "sorry about your luck".

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

I think it's hilarious that this "debate" is created by 3-5 people and gets rehashed every time the Outlaws come to PA and/or the Posse wins outside of PA. It's probably good for the sport to have such passionate debate but you'd think folks would find some other stuff to argue about.

I don't deny that there is great racing in CA and other parts of the country and there are great drivers from all over. The problem with your list is Myers, McMahon and Hannigan are no longer CA regulars. Heck we've seen Paul in PA more often than you have this year. Saw him Saturday night at Selinsgrove and he even made the feature as the first alternate. Had a much beetter run last night vs. the WOO with an 8th.

Last nights car counts Port Royal (Keystone Cup) - 39, WOO- 26

I never said that the the Posse is better than the WOO. Everyone knows Kinser is the best ever and Schatz is the best over the past couple of years. Take those two away and you have a group of racers which is on par with what we have here every week. I believe that central PA has the highest concentration of quality 410 teams and drivers anywhere in the country.

A

without Kinser you have an $18 show...as it should be.

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

Clay vs. Dirt

Wet vs. Dry

1/4 vs. 1/2 mile

No tire rule vs. Tire rule

Fuel Cost

Tow money

Get at it people

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A healthy diet of dirt in my nachos and beer.

Admittingly the Posse stats vs WoO are the best in the county over the last few years. But lets have some perspective people. The stats posted on here prove one thing only and that is no matter where they go the Outlaws usually win. At some places they win 99%, others 90%, and at the Grove for the past decade it's 70% or thereabout. Any way you slice it, that's domination.

I would also like to point out that the best of PA tend to stay in PA. Good for them. Most other greats leave in their prime for a bigger challenge than whooping the same local but every year. Kudos to Stevie Smith for at least leaving early in his career to try it. But had names like Wolfgang, Lasoski, McCarl, and Dollansky stayed on the porch win percentages posted on here by some would look really good for Knoxville as well. As would the win percentage for Knoxville regulars in PA look just as good (if not better than) the win % of Posse in Knoxville.

KJ Hawke

So, when you first started, you were just a gimmick account? And you only signed up to start trouble?? This is what you are accusing me of, is it not? Because I did not chose to sign up and participate, but rather just viewed the posts makes me a bad person? What will it take to make you believe that I am a completely new account, not a "gimmick"? Is a person's post count the only measure of merit that people consider valid? If so, I fear that I am lost. It took me 4 or 5 years to feel strongly enough about a subject to sign up and post. It may well be that long again. But, I won't be dissuaded from my viewpoint, nor scared off. I do apologize for taking so long to reply to this thread, but life intervened. Many things take precedence for me over the internet, unlike quite a few posters I've seen over the years.

I obviously am not getting through to some of the folks here by being well-spoken and mild, perhaps I should resort to being brash and pushy. No, I think not.

As far as I can see from all of the stats listed, noone comes anywhere close to approaching the level of the WoO. Be it because of $$, talent, or "That old black magic", they ARE the best. If you chose to participate in a competition knowing full well that you are at a disavantage and then don't win, man up. If you do win, be gracious. Why do you think all of the WoO drivers are quoted as saying "The Posse is the toughtest competition we face"? Graciousness, tact, and politeness are part of every great racer's equipment.

I will say this one last time for those who can't seem to understand plain English:

My only point was that noone, no sanction, no area are a fart in the wind compared to the "Greatest Show on Dirt". They may snag a win now and again, but I fail to see where that is reason to shout from the mountaintops.

Did my inclusion of a semi-off-color remark make it more comprehensible?

Bragging that someone who is no longer "Posse" won against the WoO doesn't further the PA claim to fame, it merely makes the person saying or posting it look ridiculous and feeds the widely held belief that Posse fans are rude, crude and frankly obnoxious. This also feeds the old joke that anyone who ever raced is Posse. "WOOHOO....SOMEONE WHO SAID THE WORD PENNSYLVANIA ONE TIME WON A RACE!!!". I cannot see it, sorry.

My apologies to the 99% of the Posse fans who supposedly are great race fans. Hopefully one of these days I can make my way to your fair state and partake of the atmosphere. None of my posts were directed towards them, but rather towards the ones who've been mentioned numerous times in this thread alone as "pot stirrers/cheerleaders/rah-rah boys/etc.".

Being the best of the rest is not laudatory from my viewpoint. Something to be proud of, certainly. Something to brag about to the world?? Not so much.

Lastly, if you think that only SK and Schatz are better than the rest of the country, you need a reality check. Last time I looked SK was in 5th and Schatz was in 2nd in the WoO points. Yes, it's still early in the season. But it seems that there's a lot of great racers in that sanction, and any WoO show is worth the price of admission.

Once again, Mr. Slim misses the point. The argument isn't who has the best racers in the country. It's that the PA teams are the best group of locals against the WoO.

When you consider that the only time the PA drivers even run time trials is when the WoO comes to town, it even makes it more apparent that the PA teams are the best group of locals out there. As a comparison, take a look at Knoxville, the so called "sprint car capital of the world". They run time trials every week, yet a Knoxville local hasn't beat the WoO in well over 10 years. Even worse, look at how many of the locals make the "A" main, or worse yet, how many WoO regulars watch the "A" main from atop their trailers in PA as compared to IA or CA. There is no comparison.

If you don't like Knoxville being the Sprint car Capital, then get your own track giving away about $1,000,000 in a purse and seating for almost 30,000

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A healthy diet of dirt in my nachos and beer.

I'm not missing any point, I'm trying to make my own. The original poster is claiming Mr. Dewease as Posse, but he's running with the All Stars now. Or, did you miss that point??

And my point has been and still is that bragging about 1 out of 50 makes one look foolish. Or 1 out of 10, or whatever ratio it is. To boast period is bad taste. Celebrate it amongst yourselves, but to put it out there to the world as something special is ridiculous considering the record extant.

Be proud of your local racers, we all are as well we should be. But to be so bold as to boast about being the best?? Sorry, that's sad.

 Did I state that I did not like the "title" of the sprint car capital of the world? I was merely stating that one would think that the sprint car capital of the world should be able to beat the WoO more than once a decade, especially when they have an advantage over most other local tracks in that they get to qualify each week, and everyone knows that qualifying is everything in the WoO.

Now, since you seem to like "reading between the lines". I will try my shot at it with your post.

It appears that there are a couple of folks here now that like to side step the main content of a post in order to put in their $.02 worth, even if it has nothing to do with the topic. Those two folks are also bartenders. Could it be that they are on the wrong side of the bar?

Mr. Slim, have you ever been to the Nationals?

Boasting runs rampant there, it is all a part of this sport. My driver beat your driver. Years ago, we used to bet quarters on each race, if you were on a losing streak, everyone dogged you. It's part of it.

As far as Dewease goes. How many times did he outrun the WoO as a local? More than once that I know of, even "off the porch". He has even won in Knoxville. When was the last time anyone other than a WoO regular ever won in PA?

As far as "my locals"? My locals are 1800+ miles from PA. But you can bet your ass that if one of them ever beat the WoO, I will "boast" about it. It's one HELL of an accomplishment, and they deserve the "hype" just as much as anyone.

I am also in law enforcement. It is my job to read between lines. You find truth reading between lines.

But I don't want to argue. I would rather argue about something more important than this topic. That Hawke post said it. Once our regulars get good enough they move on. If Lasoski, McCarl, Madsen, Wolgang and some others stayed around home we could win more as "locals".

Topic beat to death. I was having fun but now people are too serious. Moving on.

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A healthy diet of dirt in my nachos and beer.

wrong again Big Slim - did you watch the broadcast? (or maybe you were at the movies on Saturday?) - it was Brad Doty that called Lance and Lucas POSSE hours before this thread erupted. clear as bell...the live audio is right there for all to hear. unless youe ears are clogged by a latent agenda, delayed by years of watching MSPNs argument fail time and time again on this very website...as you wait in the wings for the right moment in time to weigh in.

IMO - calling someone a full time racer with only a dozen races under their belt by Memorial Day is far worse than bad taste as you say...it is a very expensive joke! look at the TMAC columns that appear here every week...thousands of $ in deisel...swapping crews...days of windshield time and the bills are overwhelming the budgets as these guys stuggle to stay in the tow money bracket.

i hope the weather improves in your area and you can go out and show support to your local racers when they get a shot at beating the WoO when they come to your town. i cheer for the young local drivers (underdogs & FOAW) - the next generation of drivers who make the veterans in this area earn their way to the front.

who are your favorite drivers in your area?

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

as far as the original content of the post. No the Posse does not "Suck". They are very much good at racing. I like it when they leave home and put on a show against WoO. As I like it when Knoxville guys leave home and race with WoO and win races.

As with even some Beerhill guys told me, at Nationals. The Grove is hard to race. It takes alot of regular racing there to make sure you win.

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A healthy diet of dirt in my nachos and beer.

Mr. Jackhole, how many wins against the WoO did the locals have that you listed, when they were running locally?

A correction for Mr. BRR.

There is no tow money for the WoO this year.