Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I know there has been talk about the Goodyear percieved problems this year.

But the report from Calistoga in the USAC CRA race was that 15 Hoosiers blew out (because of track conditions likely).

Guess both brands can have bad nights. Tough job making tires, you only make news when there are problems, if you are perfect nobody notices you.

Calistoga has been historical for being rough on tires. It is a very abbrasive surface, especially the 2nd night of a 2 day show. It took rubber Sunday night. I was told Calistoga track crew is going to rework the track in the off season by removing the currect dirt/clay and adding new dirt/clay, which is already located at the track.

Over the years MANY teams would not go to Calistoga because of the cost to race...not only tires..but Calistoga is not what you would call a "cheap area" to visit.

Too bad about the tire situation.

Watched a little of it on the usac site.

TSA...It's not a GROPE...it's a Freedom Pat!

Odd how when a few Goodyears fail at Knoxville over four days there is a lynch mob mentality here ... but when a bunch of teams in a two day non-wing show pop Hoosiers it seems like excuses (ie track surface) are made for them....

Phil Taylor

home-theater-systems-advice.com

Here is the right rear off of Damien Gardner's winning tire.

Pretty obvious how abbrassive the track is.

Nothing odd about why tires were blowing, nor are any excuses being made, other than stating the facts.

Not enough information to criticize IMO.

I'm not saying you're criticizing, just we'd have to see much more to make a Goodyear v. Hoosier assessment like what compound they went with, how abrasive the surface is/was, RPM etc. The track took rubber on Sunday for sure.

With an open tire rule, the fact everybody was on Hoosiers to begin with probably says more than the fact they were going down.

Ron

Wow.

An OPEN TIRE RULE.

What a brilliant idea!

TSA...It's not a GROPE...it's a Freedom Pat!

Goodyears are blowing before the tread is gone off the tire, at least the Hoosiers hold out until the tire is wore out.

I could be wrong, but I think in USAC CRA and National CRA you have to run Hoosiers and they are limited on compound choices. My guess is everyone ran the hardest available.

Watched Damion win on the net, it looked like he babied the tires most of the race. Not much sliding and little smoke. The other guys who slid their car or spun tires blew them pretty quickly.

IMHO - just because a tire blows or wears out, its not always the tire mfgs fault whether being Hoosier or Goodyear. It depends on car setup, pressure, track conditions and the drivers ability to make tires last and get the most from them without going over the limit.

Someone said over a 2 day race. I believe the 15 blown tires were for one main event of 30 laps. The night previously was 20 laps and Damion's tires were also bald coming from 13th to win.

Not an expert on the production of tires, but isn't there a human element in producing them, thus you can have a bad tire once in awhile. Happens in all forms of racing. Look at Michillin at the f1 race at Indy, Goodyear at Nascar race at Indy, both Hoosiers & Goodyear when there was a tire war in Nascar and I guess you could say Hoosiers at Calistoga. Crap happens. All 3 tire companies generally make good or superior products

Can not imagine what the tire conditions would be with wings, with more speed and downforce, and probably more HP on the cars. But how could it be worse than 15 blowouts

Open tire- not many series do that anymore. I remember when they did that in Nascar, tore up alot cars & drivers. Lots of races determined by the tire mfg and if you couldn't run that tire you were screwed big time. In F1 it probably led to the demise of the F1 race at Indy there due to the fiasco one year. But is it good for sprint car racing, maybe. Harder tires could be used at tracks like Calistoga, but I'm guessing some big name highly funded teams could get special tires especially if they do the R&D work. If it is open tire rule, have a limit on the price of each tire and make all compounds available for each team at each track. Thus everyteam has a fair shot at victory.

Concerning the last comment, goodyears blow with tread, and hoosiers blow when they wear out. Well if I was one of the drivers/teams that blew a tire Sunday, it had the same results. I would have to buy another tire and still start at the rear at best. Worse, I would be going to the hospital and/or replacing a car. There are no guarantees in racing. Thats one of the things that make it exciting to the last turn of the last lap.

The Hoosier deal with USAC is based on tire sales. They sell soft tires so they dont last more than a single race. Chaching !

The sad thing is that rubber is so important that even with an open tire rule and available compound choices the teams that have the potential to win are always gonna use the softest tire they think they can get away with. Teams with healthy tire budgets basically want the tires to look like Gardners at the end of a race. That means they got every last bit of performance out of it possible. Meanwhile someone who goes with a harder, more conservative compound will still have tread left and possibly be able to reuse the tire but they will be running 15th because everyone else has softer faster stuff on. Anyone who pops a tire and keeps the car from gettin tore up will put on a new softy and blast past the guys on harder tires in the last laps of the race.

Give me all the money I want for tires and I would do the same thing. Man it would be nice to get to run one whole season with new rubber on the car every time it hit the track. Probably won't ever happen but I can dream can't I?

Loose is when you hit the wall with the rear of the
car, tight is when you hit the wall with the front of
the car. Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall and
torque is how far you move the wall.

I heard a driver on the USAC webcast say they and basically everyone were running the next to the hardest compound available. At Knoxville Schatz said with a grin in the post race press room interview -- "We were running 100s - is there anything else?".

Phil Taylor

home-theater-systems-advice.com

ask the 15 guys who blew tires if they give a rats ass how much tread was on the tire when it blew.

Hoosier with tire issues? WHAT?!?!

I could be wrong, but I am pretty sure 2010 is the first year anyone has ever had tire issues in the history of sprint car racing, and it's all Goodyear's fault. Bastards.

Thats funny

I believe Cory Kruseman won the Midget main with a hard Hoosier according the web cast (for whats it worth)

filtalr - Its hard to believe that the sprint car drivers/teams did not run the hardest compound available if Damion in 20 laps the previous night had a complety bald tire that many said would of popped in a few more laps. My common sense is they went with harder tires for the 30 lap race. Could be wrong, and than most of the teams made bad choices and blew out/wore out 15 tires. Does a harder tire ALWAYS LAST longer? Couldn't a different sidewall construction make a difference too. I would of thought the majority of teams at Calistoga would be smarter than running softer tires than what was available, 15 blow outs and they had a harder choice, really.

I've seen a couple of Hoosier clad 360 shows and they didn't blow but sure do make a wonderful trail for the drivers to run in! It's called racing, not I found the rubber before the others did...lol

The reason nobody at Calistoga ran the hard tire is because it's a piece of junk,works fine if you run a staight 30 laps,but if you have a yellow it cools down and seals over and to the rear you go.By the way the hard tire does have a different sidewall construction,but it doesn't help the tire work any better.

Guys First time post long Time lurker and I had to chime in on this one. This was all about track prep plan and simple. My family managed that facility from 1984 to 2008 since then the fairgrounds has gone through two managers. This last manager has found a way to fire ever last one of the employees and most of the grounds keepers in the past yr. The new people do not know how to prep this track. From the reports we got from our friends the track was dry the first night and only got worse. More than half the races this season they had to take the blade to the track to fix it after some racing had started because of the bad prep. In short this has nothing to do with tires it is plain and simple BAD TRACK PREP. The bad thing about this whole season for Calistoga is that ppl are going to remember how bad the track was and the car number count is only going to get worse and worse until they get someone back in there that knows how to work that track correctly. The two guys that worked with my father for many yrs and have for that track for close to 20 yrs were told there service were no longer needed. It looks like management may have been wrong because they have not been able to have a good racing surface since. I hope that someone form the Board of Directors reads this page because until someone opens their eyes that once Great Track is going to bite the dust because of low car counts and low attendance in record time. California cannot afford to lose another dirt track and especially not one with the history like Calistoga. Moonken Motorsports

If the Calistoga Fair Board of Directors is like a lot of the other fair boards in recent history, closing the track just may be their main objective. If they hire inexperienced managers, who hire inexperienced track prep people, the attendance by owners/drivers & fans goes down. Attendance goes down, income goes down, track is lost. And the best part, for the fair board, is that their hands are clean. The managers caused the problems, not them.

I rarely disagree with you but I can assure you that this is not the case here. The fair board, the fair manager, and everyone involved in making decisions about the speedway is committed to improving it in every way possible to continue racing there. When you consider the bike race and the Vermeil weekend (I'm no USAC fan but their sanctioning fees are nothing like the WoO) they likely had a profitable season. ALL state funded facilities need to be as self sufficient as possible. Combine this with the fact that everyone I have met that is part of the current team is sincere about doing everything they can to keep this historic speedway alive. AND - I highly doubt that anyone from the fair board spends any of their time here. Besides - if they did they might be turned off by some of the "experts" that frequent here :-).