Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Just saw on the DLM side the point leader has tested positive just like the Roth's Motorsports team did last year.  Didn't USAC has a driver or two fail ?

Anyway, all the teams seem to have (simi or maybe) legitimate reason why the tires didn't pass.  I guess new excuses could be 1. a dog pee ed on  or even a competitor put the chemical on.

Do the teams trust the tests ?   Does the industry agree with testing ?  Are the tests accurate and repeatable.  Do teams have a reasonable recourse, should appeals be allowed before making it puclic knoweledge.   Soaking has been around since I started racing quarter midget in the 70's and karts in the 80's.  Nothing new.

Is it feasible for teams to buy the tires at the track and would that even stop soaking.  Read something about a drug sniffing drug  at Irwindale Speedway in So Cal for pavement.

Watch DIRTRCKR Daily for updates on the tire violations and updates:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Igh43f2Ykc

Many teams do it. Majority of the Outlaw teams from what I hear. There is a big tire doping operation located in Des Moines. Outlaws and locals use him 

What is the name of the place in DesMoines?  I find this a little hard to believe that it is a big operation.  WOO does check tires now days.  At $400 each to check tires it would be very costly for local tracks.  You check 10 tires, that is $4000 dollars.  If a tire dealer takes tires back to exchange them there is no control on the tires.  No one will ever admit they soaked a tire.  I know a driver that told me that he told owner that if car ever got DQ on rules that he still gets paid for money he earned.

Probably doesnt have a name there bud. But I know for a fact all the big teams in the des moines area use him as well as local teams. Cheating goes all the way from the outlaws to 305s at knoxville 

I had a guy tell me from a big team in the des moines area tell me " if you dont soak, you go broke " 

Interesting. So what does soaking do?  How might it be done?

Can someone explain tire doping to me better? It seems like the only factor involved would be making the tire softer? Is there a different characteristic that is affected? Could you test tires before the race for hardness, then again after the race ?

Sometimes it's just used to make a crappy tire work again.  Not always about softness, it's about making one work as it should have.

Different chemicals applied in different methods cause different reactions to happen.

Do you remember a couple of years ago when there were a bunch of tires delaminated or the tread came off the tire.  I always figured there was something being done to the tires. A lot of them were around the Knoxville area.

I remember this. Crew Chief that won the knoxville points 2018 told me hes probably the only 410 champion in the last 10 years that didnt dope. He referenced the laminating problem and said it was just too dangerous for his small family team to risk junking cars because the doper got the batch wrong. Real bad deal. Kudos to him for having the integrity not to cheat though! 

I remember Cappys words that anyone using traction control would be banned. Doping tires fall in same category. Same with big engines.

I thought I saw on a crawl streaming on DirtVision last night that a couple WoO late model drivers were suspended and fined for tires irregularities?

Did you read the first post that started this thread?

Do I have to read the first post on every thread, man that's a lot of work? Can't I just make an educated/ correct opinion and chime in with a response after glancing at the last few posts, why all the hard work and research?  

Funny and true but the problem is almost every thread is on a different topic by the 4th post.

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

These questions could leave you down one big rabbit hole. Softness is usually the factor that is most talked about but not the only one. Sometimes it used to extend the life of the tire and the whole chemical makeup of the tire to provide more traction and or how the tire actually rolls on the track. There is a tool called a durometer that officals could use but that only tells part of the story. To really get the full store you would have to take a sample of the tire with a tire groover and send it to the lab. It is generally compared by a sample from the manufacture and should have, in general, a certain chemical make up. If it doesn't you pretty much know. Also, from what I am told by our tech guys they do have tolerances and certain known chemcials that could be on the tire if they come up. Similar to a blood or pee test. There are forbidden chemicals all together, and other things such as oil or brake fluid should a driver go through some that the lab knows could show up on the track sample, but not on the controlled sample. We have had a couple tires have samples be sent to the lab as part of finishing on the podium of a regional race. Luckily everyone in our region passed. 

Bobby P. had a tire fail inspection.  The manufacuture date on the tire was 2017 according to what he said.  First I wouldn't want to run a tire of that age...secondly, do they really have the chemical analysis of the manufacturing process from 2017?

Any scientific enterprise worth its salt would be keeping records for years, so they should still have access to the information from 2017.  If it's a different lab since that time then there's ways to get that info.

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