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Topic: Dream team whats next Email this topic to a friend | Subscribe to this TopicReport this Topic to Moderator
Page 3 of 3   of  53 replies
dsc1600
October 06, 2018 at 08:37:39 AM
Joined: 05/31/2007
Posts: 2537
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Posted By: jz77 on October 06 2018 at 07:14:01 AM

Since 2009 (why 2009?) I count Posse 26, invaders 21 at the grove.  



2009 was the year the streak started. 9 straight Posse wins, only 1 win for WoO/outsiders from 2009-2010.

if you asked, what about since 2011, it would be 20 to 17 Outsiders. Just a way to cut the data.



longtimemitchfan
October 06, 2018 at 09:35:54 AM
Joined: 06/27/2012
Posts: 529
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I am definitely not a Lance fan but have been to Knoxville when Kraig Kinser,Tim Shaffer and the Late Jason Johnson won how many of these three had a shot before they won ? Heck you could even add Brad Sweet before this year.

No Shot??????????



jz77
October 06, 2018 at 10:26:48 AM
Joined: 08/19/2017
Posts: 19
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Posted By: blazer00 on October 06 2018 at 08:18:03 AM

Can you break that down?



On williamsgrove.com under history/past winners/ world of outlaw winners.  Have total wins and wins each year.  Might be off a couple.  Not sure how you count darah's, and a couple of others



dsc1600
October 06, 2018 at 10:55:18 AM
Joined: 05/31/2007
Posts: 2537
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Posted By: longtimemitchfan on October 06 2018 at 09:35:54 AM

I am definitely not a Lance fan but have been to Knoxville when Kraig Kinser,Tim Shaffer and the Late Jason Johnson won how many of these three had a shot before they won ? Heck you could even add Brad Sweet before this year.

No Shot??????????



I’ll repeat, no shot. 



blazer00
October 06, 2018 at 04:03:06 PM
Joined: 06/10/2015
Posts: 2346
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This message was edited on October 06, 2018 at 04:05:45 PM by blazer00
Reply to:
Posted By: jz77 on October 06 2018 at 10:26:48 AM

On williamsgrove.com under history/past winners/ world of outlaw winners.  Have total wins and wins each year.  Might be off a couple.  Not sure how you count darah's, and a couple of others



No big deal. I'm aware of th site and location of history stats for the Grove. I would put Darrah with one as Posse and one as Outlaw, as he was an Outlaw when he got his win in 2012. As for who your couple others are, don't know who you mean. Regardless it doesn't really matter. Like you said, depends when and how you start keeping score.  I would consider Dewease, Hodnett, Kreitz Jr, Stevie Smith, and Fred Rahmer the elder statesmen of the Posse over the past 10 years....2009-2018. That being said, they have 20 WoO wins at the Grove over that ten year period. Tells me two things, first off the Outlaws aint shit as a group compared to what they once were, and the same goes for the rest of the Posse. Those same Posse guys mentoned have most of the Posse wins as a group brfore 2009, also if I'm not mistaken. So did those older Posse guys get better or did the Outlaws as a group, and the Posse as a group fall off?  Schatz, Jason Meyers and Gravel have pretty much carried the ball for the Outlaws since 2009, speaking of the Grove results. Meyers of course retired, and Gravel is just now coming in to his own, other than that the rest of the Outlaws have been pretty much no shows at the Grove the past ten years.  Old timers Steve and Sammy each have one, Shane Stewart has one and Pittman two I believe over those ten years. My point is that the Posse and the Outlaws both really need to concentrate on finding new talent. 



revjimk
October 06, 2018 at 04:34:35 PM
Joined: 09/14/2010
Posts: 4292
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Posted By: onporch on October 05 2018 at 09:49:36 AM

 

This is what is next for the Dream team.

 

Upcoming races:

October 5th: - Double features

October 6th:   -

 

 

I like them....   But I hope they don't win all three.

 

 

 



No Tusky 50 makeup race?

Really???



jz77
October 06, 2018 at 04:42:22 PM
Joined: 08/19/2017
Posts: 19
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Now that I look back, i guess pittman's 2011 win was in heffner's car, so that is another pa win(???) Also i am not sure sammy's win in 2010 was with the outlaws or if he was more running all over and scelzi this year.  Regardless those two are not pa wins.  These are the ones I was talking about.  So if we don't count them as outlaw wins and you are comparing pa vs outlaw the numbers get even more favorable for pa.   Overall since outlaws started, it looks to be somewhere around pa 76 to outsider 131.  Again just a quick count.  Not sure about some wins like Wolfgang, Kauffman, Chris eash, stevie smith, scruffy etc.



jz77
October 06, 2018 at 04:44:38 PM
Joined: 08/19/2017
Posts: 19
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Posted By: revjimk on October 06 2018 at 04:34:35 PM

No Tusky 50 makeup race?

Really???



It is on their schedule.  That was just what was in the immediate future.



blazer00
October 07, 2018 at 02:23:16 AM
Joined: 06/10/2015
Posts: 2346
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Posted By: jz77 on October 06 2018 at 04:42:22 PM

Now that I look back, i guess pittman's 2011 win was in heffner's car, so that is another pa win(???) Also i am not sure sammy's win in 2010 was with the outlaws or if he was more running all over and scelzi this year.  Regardless those two are not pa wins.  These are the ones I was talking about.  So if we don't count them as outlaw wins and you are comparing pa vs outlaw the numbers get even more favorable for pa.   Overall since outlaws started, it looks to be somewhere around pa 76 to outsider 131.  Again just a quick count.  Not sure about some wins like Wolfgang, Kauffman, Chris eash, stevie smith, scruffy etc.



As far as the drivers you mentioned, for those years those drivers were running for Outlaw points, they were Outlaws. Other years they were Posse.  As for Wolfgang, his three wins at the Grove during the Weikert years imo are invader.....not Outlaw and by the way he was consistantly booed by the Posse fans, not Posse. wink But it was only three wins so who cares.



longtimefan
October 07, 2018 at 04:27:33 PM
Joined: 12/02/2004
Posts: 215
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Posted By: blazer00 on October 07 2018 at 02:23:16 AM

As far as the drivers you mentioned, for those years those drivers were running for Outlaw points, they were Outlaws. Other years they were Posse.  As for Wolfgang, his three wins at the Grove during the Weikert years imo are invader.....not Outlaw and by the way he was consistantly booed by the Posse fans, not Posse. wink But it was only three wins so who cares.



I am not sure if you were at races and heard Wolfgang consistantly booed or just heard it somewhere. I was at a lot of the races that he won and don't remember that. If you were at some races and heard some people boo him keep in mind that if Jesus were the win too many some fans would boo him.



blazer00
October 07, 2018 at 05:20:35 PM
Joined: 06/10/2015
Posts: 2346
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Posted By: longtimefan on October 07 2018 at 04:27:33 PM

I am not sure if you were at races and heard Wolfgang consistantly booed or just heard it somewhere. I was at a lot of the races that he won and don't remember that. If you were at some races and heard some people boo him keep in mind that if Jesus were the win too many some fans would boo him.



Actually it was Doug himself telling me about his experiences in PA some years back. It was mostly at Williams Grove where he heard the majority of the boos. He makes a point of that in his book, also. Even Bob Weikert is on tape doing an interview after a race win, "Yeh you boo us this week but you'll be cheering us next week when we beat the Outlaws". And I know Doug heard some cheers out there, also. After a win at the Tuscarora 50 in 1985, one of the contingency prizes was a case of PBR. Doug said that he "knew Pabst was Van Mays favorite drink and that he would only drink half the case and save the other half of the case and drink it with Van when he got out of the hospital". As you know, Van was hurt pretty bad  that same night ar the Tuscarora 50. The crowd appreciated Doug's thought.



x83fan
MyWebsite
October 08, 2018 at 02:15:45 PM
Joined: 01/15/2005
Posts: 98
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Posted By: blazer00 on October 07 2018 at 05:20:35 PM

Actually it was Doug himself telling me about his experiences in PA some years back. It was mostly at Williams Grove where he heard the majority of the boos. He makes a point of that in his book, also. Even Bob Weikert is on tape doing an interview after a race win, "Yeh you boo us this week but you'll be cheering us next week when we beat the Outlaws". And I know Doug heard some cheers out there, also. After a win at the Tuscarora 50 in 1985, one of the contingency prizes was a case of PBR. Doug said that he "knew Pabst was Van Mays favorite drink and that he would only drink half the case and save the other half of the case and drink it with Van when he got out of the hospital". As you know, Van was hurt pretty bad  that same night ar the Tuscarora 50. The crowd appreciated Doug's thought.



this man you speak of, Doug Wolfgang, I met & spoke with 1 time. It was while standing in line at a go-kart facility in Fargo. a genuine class act in my book. we bs'd about everything from him racing at our small hometown track in Santa Maria, Ca. to his unfortunate accident & a lot of stuff in between. I got to get after it with him out on that kart track, what a riot, i laughed so hard had tears for days. dude was a badass



longtimemitchfan
October 09, 2018 at 12:55:45 PM
Joined: 06/27/2012
Posts: 529
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I dont know which side of the arguement you put him on but the last time Sammy won the National Open he was NOT an Outlaw regular that year Remember him holding off Lance and being glad that a neutral driver won .like this year at The Dirt Classic way to go Tim,Great move for him coming in could have ran in New York or got rained out with the All Srars



blazer00
October 09, 2018 at 03:10:17 PM
Joined: 06/10/2015
Posts: 2346
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Posted By: longtimemitchfan on October 09 2018 at 12:55:45 PM

I dont know which side of the arguement you put him on but the last time Sammy won the National Open he was NOT an Outlaw regular that year Remember him holding off Lance and being glad that a neutral driver won .like this year at The Dirt Classic way to go Tim,Great move for him coming in could have ran in New York or got rained out with the All Srars



Sammy was a nuetral invader in 2010 driving the Big Game Treestands #1.





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