Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

It is the tracks responsiblility to finish the show unless it is impossible. Anything less is selfish or ill motivated. Racing the next day is an excuse as far as i am concerned cause wasnt it last summer schatz won 2 features on the same day cause of a 3 hr rain delay? Maybe the wrong driver but im sure i read something about that seldom happening.

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

The situation Saturday night was certainly less than ideal for everyone involved.  The 6-7 hour drive to Ransomville was obviously a factor--I packed up my equipment after the announcement that the race was postponed, loaded it into my motorhome and drove straight to Ransomville.  I arrived at 7:52am.  We were at least 90 minutes from having the track ready for racing.  It just wouldn't have been possible for our teams, officials, etc. to wait on the POSSIBILITY that the rain was finished and we could race, then SAFELY make the drive to NY and race again Sunday. (Keep in mind that in order to set up for a race, the officials, etc. need to be on site between 12-1pm.)  Again, it's not ideal for anyone. But is it fair to the fans in Ransomville to say "sorry, we had to cancel your race because of rain the night before at Williams Grove"?  My only comment about the rain policy would be to point out that if you go to a major league baseball game and it rains after 5 innings and the game can't be finished that day, it's considered an "official" game, and treated as such. 

So why schedule a race such a long distance away the next day?

$$$$$$$$$$$

I agree, next year they should just have Williams Grove on Friday and no races saturday and Ransomville on Sunday. Good idea. 

To be fair I don't know the extent of your equipement, but it took you 10 hours to pack up and make a 6 hour drive?

A baseball rainout doesn't affect the salaries paid by the team owner. His expenses remain the same. If a Sprint car show is considered complete after the heats, and the Feature never run.....the promoters a quite a bit ahead, are they not?

The A-main WILL be run and the full purse will  be paid--that's always the case when the show is considered "complete".  The competitors are owed an A-main when we reach the point where refunds are no longer provided.

With a fuel stop and by staying on interstate (81 to 90), it was closer to 8 hours of driving. (Chose that route with a motorhome--fewer steep hills, and more places to stop & sleep if I got too tired to go all the way.)

I don't know how you do it Johnny. I find it difficult driving at night. A couple of hours on the road and I'm ready to pull over and sleep. I do my fair share of driving to races and would rather just spend the night in a motel. You, the officials and all the teams are road warriors for sure. 

Knoxville Natioanls attendee since '95
Favorite Tracks...River Cities, Knoxville, Cedar Lake
Favorite Drivers...S.Kinser, T.Kaeding, K.Madsen, S.Smith
Proud Canadian 

I was just gonna stay out of this but here we go.

Mr. Gibson in all due respect when a ball game is called official after 5 innings the most important portion of the game isn't made up on a subsequent game.  Once it's called it's called.  

That is exactly what happened here. If the decision to not makeup the A main at all had been decided then I think most of us would be alittle better about the situation.  Quite frankly it pisses me off alittle because the whole thing is a double standard and contradicts itself even in the WOO press release.

If it's to be a rain out call it a rain out.  If it's going to be rescheduled then call it rescheduled.  Don't call it official and then the next sentence state the A main will be run the first night of the National Open on Thursday.  Not only do you screw folks out of their time and money but it insults our intellect.  Sir, if the whole thing doesn't seem disingenuous to you then I'm not sure what to think and I will question spending any money with either establishment in the future.  I actually expect an honest and candid answer.  I'm not going to insult you or your organization but perception is truth. 

I totally understand the driving portion that you mentioned and agree that if took an hour or so to get the track into shape it would have been a situation where it would have been dangerous for you guys going up the road. Not to mention there was no guarantee it wouldn't have rained again.  I can't Monday morning quarterback that decision.  Calling the race IMO was the right call, but how the A main makeup was handled was piss poor in my judgement.  

I bought 3 reserved tickets and brought my 2 young daughters (13 and 6) with me.  And while I'm not exactly happy about getting screwed out of $100 and not seeing the A main, what irritates me the most is how the situation was handled. 

I'm sorry you're upset with the way the make-up main event was handled, but that's pretty much "standard" procedure for any race track and any touring series that I'm aware of.  And even this board shows the disparity of opinion among fans:  Some saying that promotors have no right to keep the A-main money if the A-main isn't run but refunds aren't given.  Bottom line there's no GOOD way to handle this situation, but in my opinion it was handled the best way possible under the circumstances and in accordance with generally acccepted short track racing traditions. 

I think Johnny Gibson is a great guy... BUT, the WoO DID NOT do everything in their power on Saturday night. Weather was a factor all weekend, so why not pack the track ealier, and then not screw around so long in hot laps? It was well past 6 when hot laps happened, Id say it was around 6:45 or 7 when they finally did, and it seemed to take a long time, alot longer than usual. Then qualifying was slow also. So, when the WoO finally pulled their heads out of their asses, and realized there was gonna be rain agian(like anyone for the last 2 or 3 hours didnt see it coming by looking a the radar) they finally ran the show quicker, and got through the heats, dash and B main quickly. Then it started sprinkling at the end of the B main. They held off for the A while is was sprinkling, it wasnt raining hard at all(my friend and I stayed in the stands the whole time till they called the race and we did not get soaked at all, it wasnt raing hard). IF the WoO would of tried in the beginning to get the show going earlier and/or not taken so long in the beginning, the show would of been gotten in completely!

I wont be back for the A main at a later date, I live 370 miles from the track and can't make a quick trip to the speedway. I was "screwed" by the WoO and them not getting the program in, or trying to get it in!  I am disappointed by the way the show was run. I was at Knoxville this year(JUne 10th), Eldora for the KR, and then at Williams Grove the week after... just seems that they screwed around to much at Williams Grove on Saturday to ACTUALLY TRY and get the show in!

The Crowd Pleaser IS THE BEST ever!

Potential solution for WoO to consider... give free viewing to the September 28th show (the entire night not just the first A feature) via DirtVision.  Don't know if there is a way to verify people with ticket stubs via some sort of ticket number verification and only give them free access, but if not just air the entire night for free for everyone as a PR move.  

Some who can't make it back might say its not the same as seeing the feature live (and its not)... but the trade off is getting to watch the entire night's races on the 28th for free.

On another note... I had to fly back to Florida Sunday when Nationals were delayed due to rain.  Honestly after a brief Saturday afternoon shower the rest of the night was gorgeous.  Cost me $200 in tickets I couldn't use and didn't get to see Kraig Kinser win it Sunday.  I sure would have loved for them to try like crazy to get the track ready Saturday night, but certainly wasn't a wasted trip and certainly don't blame Knoxville for mother nature or their decision.  That's what happens when you race on dirt.    

Screw "standard" procedure......The Greatest Show On Dirt should be setting and defining standards, not hiding behind them!

Not sure what you mean by saying it took forever to hotlap.  Drivers meeting was scheduled for 6:30 with qualifying at 7:15.  (That is Williams Grove's "normal" time.)  Qualifying is never fast at Williams Grove: 16-17 second laps, and the split pit area which presents logistical problems and means we have to take a couple of breaks in qualifying to cross cars back & forth between the front & back pits.  We ran as quickly as possible from the time we put cars on the track for warm-ups, which went according to schedule. Even with rain in the area, we can't start BEFORE the advertised time.  That's not fair to those who plan their evening according to the published schedule.  I attended a track that started early due to weather (as a fan), and missed the first few heats beacuse I assumed the engine noise I heard was hotlaps since it wasn't the scheduled starting time.  I was NOT happy.)  Again, Saturday was a MUCH less than ideal situation, but to say we didn't do everything we could to get the program in before the rain is just not true.

Bottom line: some people will be upset no matter what call is made in that situation.  But I personally don't think anything could/should have been done differently.  If you're not happy, I'm sorry, and hope that you'll enjoy World of Outlaws Craftsman Sprint Car Series racing in the future. 

No one is happy to pay money and not get product. Thats obvious but correct me if I am wrong but does Johnny Gibson make these decisions himself? I have to commend him for coming on here and sharing the side of the WoO and risking a lashing for being part of the organization frowned upon at the moment.

Thanks for the info but we need to realize Johnny is in a tough spot. Seems to me part of him wants to be our friend and try to explain things to us while the other part of him is an employee who can't trash talk his employer even if he agreed with most of us.

But I do have to agree with the post about calling a spade a spade. If the race is complete why does it still need to be completed?

So where does the prize money go if the feature is never raced? Maybe there is risk to to all 3 parties involved. The fan can pay the money and not get a race, the teams can register and not get a feature and the track can put up the prize money and not get fans

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

I thought the show was run off pretty swiftly myself. My only complaint is on the scheduling . I don't see any reason to schedule another race that distance away from a track that is holding a two day, high paying race. Many teams AND fans spent days at the track for a premiere  event, only to be shortchanged at the end because the "show" had to leave by a certain time. Couldn't the scheduling be worked out a little more sensible? If the traveling time dictates when the previous nights' racing has to end, I think there is a problem. Not long after canceling, the rain stopped. The track could have been ran back in, and I'm sure the races would have been completed. It never rained another drop the rest of the night.

Confused...cause I called the track to order tickets and was told specifically that the drivers meeting was at 5:30, and hot laps at 6:00. I agree that I have NEVER seen a track start on time, but they should have for sure last Saturday.  

Yes, I will go to many more WoO shows, since it is my favorite racing there is... But, what I was saying is I think the WoO did a poor job of trying to get the show in when it started later than was supposed to. Johnny Gibson is the "voice" of the WoO on and off the track so it seems. I think he is the BEST ANNOUNCER ever, no one has such enthusiasm! Just seems to be a let down when you see all the other stuff and not the Grand Finally(A main).

The Crowd Pleaser IS THE BEST ever!