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Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
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Topic: Sprint Cars and Data Acquisition Email this topic to a friend | Subscribe to this TopicReport this Topic to Moderator
Page 1 of 2   of  20 replies
shiftsport
October 12, 2017 at 03:54:50 PM
Joined: 09/27/2017
Posts: 3
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Always curious and hoping someone can enlighten me.......why data acquisition is not allowed on most major sprint car series while allowed in most other forms of motorsports?




nzsprint
October 12, 2017 at 04:45:44 PM
Joined: 11/27/2012
Posts: 37
Reply
Reply to:
Posted By: shiftsport on October 12 2017 at 03:54:50 PM

Always curious and hoping someone can enlighten me.......why data acquisition is not allowed on most major sprint car series while allowed in most other forms of motorsports?



I guess it would be a cost thing. Any data logging on any race car, will almost certainly require a laptop and software to read the data which equals $$$, then you'll need a crew member to analyize that data during/after each race, more $$$, all of a sudden the big teams will have a full-time analyst at the track looking at data in real time. All it would add up to is a larger gap between super teams (TSR, KKR etc) and middle/working man teams.

 

 

 



shiftsport
October 12, 2017 at 05:03:03 PM
Joined: 09/27/2017
Posts: 3
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Reply to:
Posted By: nzsprint on October 12 2017 at 04:45:44 PM

I guess it would be a cost thing. Any data logging on any race car, will almost certainly require a laptop and software to read the data which equals $$$, then you'll need a crew member to analyize that data during/after each race, more $$$, all of a sudden the big teams will have a full-time analyst at the track looking at data in real time. All it would add up to is a larger gap between super teams (TSR, KKR etc) and middle/working man teams.

 

 

 



The fact is, data logging systems have come way down and quite affordable.  Even karting teams are using them so that theory doesn't hold water in my eyes and we have kids using that data to become better drivers.  You can prevent real-time data acquisition (lots of other forms of motorsports allow DA but not in real time).   I get that DA seems scary but with today's systems and ease of use software, it's not rocket science.  

I just think it's a valuable tool for drivers and teams to overlay on-track performance with the setups.  I am in fact aware of bio-feedback of heart rates, BP and other human performance data being overlayed with DA data downloaded from sports cars.  

Thanks for chiming in NZ.....



nzsprint
October 12, 2017 at 05:57:07 PM
Joined: 11/27/2012
Posts: 37
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All just my opinion shiftsport Smile I can just see it escalating out of the budget teams ability to keep up with the pros. Also, my view is more old school, I like the drivers ability and communication to the crew cheif to make up the majority of the cars performance on track. I see DA as something that will lessen the importance of a good driver/crew chief combination.

I think one of the great things about dirt track racing is the driver still makes up a huge percentage of the success of a team. You look at F1 and Nascar over the last few years, the technology and cost to make the cars faster but more driveable has made the driver part of the team performance less and less important. Honestly I think you could take any current F1 driver and put them in the current Mercedes or Ferrari F1 seats and they would instantly be a championship contender. Because the car makes up 90% of the performance of the team in F1, I would say in Sprintcar racing its probably more like 60% car and 40% driver/crew chief.

 

 



cubicdollars
October 12, 2017 at 06:09:03 PM
Joined: 02/27/2005
Posts: 4104
Reply

Get real, even NASCAR doesn’t allow data acquisition in races due to cost concerns and they have $10M budgets.

They are allowed to wear a watch this year though...lol.

• Drivers in all three series may use biometrics devices in their vehicles in 2017. The wrist-worn health tracking devices may not transmit data, may not connect to the vehicle in any way and must operate on an internal battery. Devices eligible for use are certain models made by Garmin, Misfit, Polar, Samsung, Tom Tom and Jawbone.


 

 

 

They don't even know how to spell sprint car much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com


brettco
October 12, 2017 at 08:32:46 PM
Joined: 12/03/2004
Posts: 489
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Posted By: shiftsport on October 12 2017 at 05:03:03 PM

The fact is, data logging systems have come way down and quite affordable.  Even karting teams are using them so that theory doesn't hold water in my eyes and we have kids using that data to become better drivers.  You can prevent real-time data acquisition (lots of other forms of motorsports allow DA but not in real time).   I get that DA seems scary but with today's systems and ease of use software, it's not rocket science.  

I just think it's a valuable tool for drivers and teams to overlay on-track performance with the setups.  I am in fact aware of bio-feedback of heart rates, BP and other human performance data being overlayed with DA data downloaded from sports cars.  

Thanks for chiming in NZ.....



 I wonder how we can change things to suck the last sliver of fun out of winged sprint car racing- there must be a way! 

 Data- what did you say?



motorhead748
October 12, 2017 at 09:28:16 PM
Joined: 08/05/2010
Posts: 397
Reply

Technology is the problem, not the solution. 



RodinCanada
MyWebsite
October 13, 2017 at 09:39:48 AM
Joined: 07/24/2016
Posts: 121
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To quote another poster...

"^ +1".



The Fox
October 13, 2017 at 10:47:35 AM
Joined: 12/13/2006
Posts: 12
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Are any of the MyChron devices allowed in the Sprint Car world?



BigRightRear
October 13, 2017 at 10:52:21 AM
Joined: 11/27/2004
Posts: 3665
Reply

If I am not mistaken, Meyers rented the track at Kville and ran test laps with sensors to collect data...may not be allowed during a race, but perhaps for testing?


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weather." Van May

StanM
MyWebsite MyResults MyPressRelease
October 13, 2017 at 11:24:14 AM
Joined: 11/07/2006
Posts: 3958
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Reply to:
Posted By: shiftsport on October 12 2017 at 03:54:50 PM

Always curious and hoping someone can enlighten me.......why data acquisition is not allowed on most major sprint car series while allowed in most other forms of motorsports?



Sprint Car raciing has always been about making the best decision on setup and the driver mashing the gas for 30 laps or however many the Feature is.  They're getting more techy to setup but there still is a simplicity to them that I find refreshing.  Local teams would struggle even more if this ever became a thing in Sprints.


Stan Meissner

champphotos
MyWebsite
October 14, 2017 at 02:11:17 PM
Joined: 05/21/2011
Posts: 145
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The stuff is fairly cheap compared to 10 years ago. It also is happening in LM, people are just not talking about it. 

It will be working it’s way into Sprint Cars very soon, guaranteed. 

DA



alum.427
October 15, 2017 at 07:38:42 AM
Joined: 03/16/2017
Posts: 387
Reply

Guys are testing with DA systems on-board.   Heck you can take your dirt car to a table and strap it down and test. TO say NASCRAP doesn't allow DA is a joke. They put those cars on a table constitently, then from there they go straight to the wind tunnel.  All racing series from WoO to NASCRAP, need to get a control on spending, problem is the big money teams won't and don't want to see it happen. The fix is easy, problem is nobody with $$$ wants it.



StanM
MyWebsite MyResults MyPressRelease
October 15, 2017 at 09:50:37 AM
Joined: 11/07/2006
Posts: 3958
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Reply to:
Posted By: brettco on October 12 2017 at 08:32:46 PM

 I wonder how we can change things to suck the last sliver of fun out of winged sprint car racing- there must be a way! 

 Data- what did you say?



Back in the day we said that same thing when they sprouted wings.  wink


Stan Meissner

Keyboard Jockey
October 16, 2017 at 12:56:33 PM
Joined: 04/16/2014
Posts: 201
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Reply to:
Posted By: shiftsport on October 12 2017 at 05:03:03 PM

The fact is, data logging systems have come way down and quite affordable.  Even karting teams are using them so that theory doesn't hold water in my eyes and we have kids using that data to become better drivers.  You can prevent real-time data acquisition (lots of other forms of motorsports allow DA but not in real time).   I get that DA seems scary but with today's systems and ease of use software, it's not rocket science.  

I just think it's a valuable tool for drivers and teams to overlay on-track performance with the setups.  I am in fact aware of bio-feedback of heart rates, BP and other human performance data being overlayed with DA data downloaded from sports cars.  

Thanks for chiming in NZ.....



Being these are your first two posts fishing about Data Acquisition leads me to believe you may be in the business of selling data acquisition... can you tell me what you are selling? I would like to buy it!



blazer00
October 16, 2017 at 01:23:01 PM
Joined: 06/10/2015
Posts: 1393
Reply

Why hell yes!! Why not?? The damn things are already driving like a damn slot car with exposed magnets. I agree, let's take even more crew chief and driver out of the equation. Let a computer and a geek have it. I could give two shits if the damn system only cost $1.00, the big money teams will still have the edge because they can still spend the money to get all the shit they need to go faster than the lesser teams, and with the DA system they can get a better grip on when to spend that money to replace those parts. The lesser teams will also know when parts need replaced, but of course they won't have the money anyhow so they still won't catch up with the big money boys.! Why, with technology, there might even come the day when the wealthy fans in the stands will be driving the damn things with remote control, lane change warning, frontal impact automatic breaking and GPS avoidance. Wouldn't that be something! And hell, might as well have a cushy recliner and a set of controls upstairs for the flagman, as well.



blazer00
October 16, 2017 at 01:31:06 PM
Joined: 06/10/2015
Posts: 1393
Reply
Reply to:
Posted By: shiftsport on October 12 2017 at 03:54:50 PM

Always curious and hoping someone can enlighten me.......why data acquisition is not allowed on most major sprint car series while allowed in most other forms of motorsports?



And in direct response to your question, in most other forms of motorsports that have implemented DA for some time, the costs of doing business and being competitive are in the MILLIONS of $$$.....like in SEVERAL MILLION per season. So what's the added cost really of DA for them? And the racing in those forms has beome less interesting in my opinion for quite some time. now.



alum.427
October 17, 2017 at 08:23:32 AM
Joined: 03/16/2017
Posts: 387
Reply

blazer got it...... look at NASCRAP,  aero,aero,aero = boring as hell racing. take a sawsall blade and cut all that crap off and let the driver wheel the car.



shiftsport
October 18, 2017 at 02:55:17 PM
Joined: 09/27/2017
Posts: 3
Reply
This message was edited on October 18, 2017 at 03:00:07 PM by shiftsport

Thanks everyone for chiming in and I feel the need to clarify a couple points being brought up since I feel I struck a nerve here.

  1. I don't sell DA equipment, it's not even close to what I do for a living (aerospace & defense).
  2. My first and utmost passion are sprint cars and while I enjoy all forms of motorsports, I love the simplicity of dirt tracks and sprint cars so please don't assume that I also believe that DA on a full-time basis is good for the sport.
  3. I do see some sort of DA on a testing/pre season level a good thing.

With that said, I am headed to Trophy Cup.

 

 



Keyboard Jockey
October 18, 2017 at 03:33:11 PM
Joined: 04/16/2014
Posts: 201
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Reply to:
Posted By: shiftsport on October 18 2017 at 02:55:17 PM

Thanks everyone for chiming in and I feel the need to clarify a couple points being brought up since I feel I struck a nerve here.

  1. I don't sell DA equipment, it's not even close to what I do for a living (aerospace & defense).
  2. My first and utmost passion are sprint cars and while I enjoy all forms of motorsports, I love the simplicity of dirt tracks and sprint cars so please don't assume that I also believe that DA on a full-time basis is good for the sport.
  3. I do see some sort of DA on a testing/pre season level a good thing.

With that said, I am headed to Trophy Cup.

 

 



Dang! I was hoping to buy LOL. I think the reason you dont see as much as far as DA on sprint cars is because driving a spirnt car has so many variables that are input from the driver, moreso than NASCAR ect. I could see TPS, shock position and load sensors on the wings being a huge advantage if someone was able to interpret the data aquired. Then you would have to do it all over again once the car was in traffic. 

Have fun at the TC, thats one of my top 5 fav races!





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